[Chat] Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

[Uncle Bob]

[VeganPrincess]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

The Anaheim Garden Walk is part of the greater "Anaheim Resort," not the Disneyland Resort. I feel that Disney buying the Garden Walk would just make it a second Downtown Disney. As is, the Garden Walk is more upscale and geared towards an older, more local audience.

It is described as "The OC's new hotspot for food, fashion, and fun."

http://www.anaheimgardenwalk.com/

[SwordintheStone]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

hmm.. maybe if they changed garden walk into more rides and attractions the "OC's new hotspot for food, fashion, and fun" would now be DTD. possibly more stores and more customers?

[Uncle Bob]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

The Anaheim Garden Walk is part of the greater "Anaheim Resort," not the Disneyland Resort. I feel that Disney buying the Garden Walk would just make it a second Downtown Disney. As is, the Garden Walk is more upscale and geared towards an older, more local audience.

It is described as "The OC's new hotspot for food, fashion, and fun."
http://www.anaheimgardenwalk.com/

Yes, but if they expand the resort and build the third gate in the strawberry field, the AGW will become a central part of the DLR, not just the Anaheim Resort District. Owning this space would simply give Disney more options and control in terms of how they developed the resort. I also don't see why Dinsey couldn't own the facility, just because it's focussed on a more adult audience.

It already essentially is going to have the feeling of being the East wing of DTD, and I think once the resort is completely developed, and a few Disney operated hotels are built in the AGW, most guests will assume the AGW is owned by Disney, whether it is or not. I really don't see how the ownership would effect any of the things that you pointed out.

[almandot]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

It depends. It'll give an impression of What's the point of developing something in Anaheim if Disney's just going to buy it out from you. Whether you think that's a positive or negative may vary.

[Coheteboy]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

My answer is: no.

Not yet anyway. Disney to swallow up a new shopping district would require many people to handle the overall center in more ways necessary than it would to just have each individual business handle their own.

When that happens, sure you get a place that has a "disney" name on it, but the actual stores and restaurants may suffer. Disney would start picking and choosing what they THINK is best for the consumer rather than going with gut instincts.

Guests would complain about some nightclub because it's "NOT DISNEY".


Look at Downtown Disney for the nearest example. How many of you actually shop in those stores frequently? Aside for the pin shack and World of Disney, I have no reason to buy anything from any of the other locations (cos i'm a dude that already has sunglasses and beach clothes and don't wear makeup).

Look at the restaurants. Sure most of them are pretty good, reliable places to eat. But do you ever want to go to those places? It's almost like someone has to twist my arm for me to go to Naples or Catal.


There's just something too manufactured about Downtown Disney. It's too sterile. Gardenwalk is almost a breath of fresh air in comparison.

[Dustysage]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

It'll give an impression of What's the point of developing something in Anaheim if Disney's just going to buy it out from you.

Only, in this case, the owner is looking to sell it.

This is a piece of property which sits next to two hotels that Disney wants to build, located between two major Disney parking lots - one for guests and one for cast members, and which serves as a bridge to the future location of Disney's 3rd gate. If you look on a map at this property, Disney owns a corridor stretching from the lion king tram load/unload almost to the field where the 3rd park is supposed to go. The major exception being the Garden Walk.

I think it would be mismanagement for Disney not to buy this property if they can get it.

[Uncle Bob]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

It depends. It'll give an impression of What's the point of developing something in Anaheim if Disney's just going to buy it out from you. Whether you think that's a positive or negative may vary.

Um, if I were a developer, my goal would be for Disney to buy me out. They don't have to sell if they don't want to, and the developer has chosen to shop the project around, why would they care who buys it as long as they get their price?

I just don't see this as a valid arguement. This is one specific delvelopment that is integral to the DLR development. I don't think Disney buying this one property would drive fears that Disney was going to be buying up every development in the city. That's just not a realistic worry, and Disney would have no reason to do so.

[Bruce Bergman]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

Only, in this case, the owner is looking to sell it.

This is a piece of property which sits next to two hotels that Disney wants to build, located between two major Disney parking lots - one for guests and one for cast members, and which serves as a bridge to the future location of Disney's 3rd gate. If you look on a map at this property, Disney owns a corridor stretching from the lion king tram load/unload almost to the field where the 3rd park is supposed to go. The major exception being the Garden Walk.

I think it would be mismanagement for Disney not to buy this property if they can get it.

.... At a reasonable price for the property involved.

If they just sunk a ton of money into land, new buildings and landscape to develop GardenWalk, the only way they are going to sell it without a big premium tacked on is if they're having a money crunch and need to unload it fairly fast. Things can happen (Note: Speculation Only!) like they went to the bank to convert the Construction Loan into a Commercial Mortgage and couldn't do it. Or they are a division of a bigger corporation that decided to change focus and get out of the shopping mall business.

Which could happen, the way the economy is faltering - it's temporary of course, but 'temporary' could be three months or three years...

Same thing for buying out the other properties on the southeast corner of DCA, the motels and 7-11 store - Sure they'll sell their land and move, but not at a price anyone wants to pay.

--<< Bruce >>--

[Uncle Bob]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

My answer is: no.

Not yet anyway. Disney to swallow up a new shopping district would require many people to handle the overall center in more ways necessary than it would to just have each individual business handle their own.

When that happens, sure you get a place that has a "disney" name on it, but the actual stores and restaurants may suffer. Disney would start picking and choosing what they THINK is best for the consumer rather than going with gut instincts.

Guests would complain about some nightclub because it's "NOT DISNEY".


Look at Downtown Disney for the nearest example. How many of you actually shop in those stores frequently? Aside for the pin shack and World of Disney, I have no reason to buy anything from any of the other locations (cos i'm a dude that already has sunglasses and beach clothes and don't wear makeup).

Look at the restaurants. Sure most of them are pretty good, reliable places to eat. But do you ever want to go to those places? It's almost like someone has to twist my arm for me to go to Naples or Catal.


There's just something too manufactured about Downtown Disney. It's too sterile. Gardenwalk is almost a breath of fresh air in comparison.

This is probably the best reasoned arguement so far against Disney owning the AGW, but I still see some problems with it. I agree that there could be issues with Disney limiting the offerings of the AGW. It's a valid concern, but in reality I don't think it would be a big problem.

One issue is that, like I said before, the perception of most guests will be that the AGW is a Disney property no matter what. Some guests will still complain that the offerings at AGW are not family friendly enough anyway, and Disney will have no way to control the issue, if there was a problem business that they really felt needed to be removed for PR reasons.

Also, most of the businesses already in the AGW would stay, no matter who the owner becomes. They all have long term leases, and Dis would not be able to remove them, even if they wanted to, unless they broke the terms of their lease.

Additionally, I don't understand your arguement about more people being needed to run AWG. Basically, it would only require a small addition to the staff that already runs DTD. All they are is a property manager, all the businesses would be owned by other companies. Disney would just need employees to collect rent and supervise new leases and maintenance and things like that. They wouldn't even have to pay for property tax, insurance, or maintenance, because in commercial leases, those costs are typically passed on the the tennant in the form of Tripple Net.

The last arguement that AGW is nicer than DTD doesn't really make sense either. Why would this prevent Disney from owning it? If it's nice, why wouldn't they want to own it, and bring DTD up to an equivalent quality level? We all know that DTD suffered from a Pressler era budget, thus its flaws, but I just don't follow this arguement. Why it should mean that Dis shouldn't buy the property?

[Uncle Bob]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

Basically, what Dusty and Bruce said is at the heart of my post. I agree with Dusty that it would be smart to buy the property if they can, and I agree with Bruce that the price is likely the sticking point that may be preventing them from buying it.

I was interested to know if anyone really knows what's going on with the parent company and why they are trying to sell. Perhaps it was always their plan to build it and then sell it off, in which case they'll certainly want to make a profit. But it's equally possible that they need to sell because they are in financial trouble or just changing business focus in some way. In any case, if the price is reasonable, it would seem to make sense for Disney to buy it, unless there are some other limitations, that would cause dificulty for Disney to own it.

[Craigroy8287]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

I like that idea. It would just mean more money for the Disney Company.

[KeepnLuciferHuntn]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

Would it be along the same thinking as W.E.D. and his dreams?

[Coheteboy]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

Additionally, I don't understand your arguement about more people being needed to run AWG. Basically, it would only require a small addition to the staff that already runs DTD. All they are is a property manager, all the businesses would be owned by other companies. Disney would just need employees to collect rent and supervise new leases and maintenance and things like that. They wouldn't even have to pay for property tax, insurance, or maintenance, because in commercial leases, those costs are typically passed on the the tennant in the form of Tripple Net.

I'm just saying that if Disney wants to own it, it's going to require a lot more staff to keep things running to Disney's standards. How many staff, I don't know exactly but if they just have the downtown disney team run it, I think they may stretch themselves too thin.

The Disney experience is expected all around, even if it is just a fancy shopping center so you have a team of disney staffers in charge of retaining that.

I'm not against it, I just don't see Downtown Disney filled to its greatest potential. Not even close. Is it a safe and decent experience? Yes. But it still doesn't feel very Disney to me. And I'd rather Disney keep their hands off Gardenwalk until they can figure it out.

[mycroft16]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

I've got to agree with Bruce and Dusty. It is a really great idea to grab it if they can.

I think it isn't just the price that might be a sticking point though... but the themeing of the AGW. Disney would probably come through it and redecorate a fair bit. They may not. It would depend I guess. But I can see them looking at it that was as well as price. "What are we going to have to do to it to make it how WE want it?" is probably a question that is being asked if they are even considering it.

This sudden shopping of the complex around before it is even really complete just screams internal trouble of some kind for the owners. I like Bruce's suggestions as to why and think they are all really valid options.

[Uncle Bob]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

I'm just saying that if Disney wants to own it, it's going to require a lot more staff to keep things running to Disney's standards. How many staff, I don't know exactly but if they just have the downtown disney team run it, I think they may stretch themselves too thin.

The Disney experience is expected all around, even if it is just a fancy shopping center so you have a team of disney staffers in charge of retaining that.

I'm not against it, I just don't see Downtown Disney filled to its greatest potential. Not even close. Is it a safe and decent experience? Yes. But it still doesn't feel very Disney to me. And I'd rather Disney keep their hands off Gardenwalk until they can figure it out.

I agree that they need to have a plan as to how AGW would be integrated into the resort, and what changes Disney would want to make before they bought it. That should go without saying. Nonetheless, I think if they have an opportunity to buy it now, at a decent price, I think it would be smart to grab it. Why hold off and miss their chance at getting it? Even if those other changes were not going to happen for several years, at least they'd have the property, and they could design the new hotels for the area exactly how they want them.

[FutureImagineer]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

Uncle Bob, i think it would be a pretty good idea. It would definitely be a good thing for disney because when they build the third park, guests will walk thru a shopping mall and why would Disney want thier guests to shop somewhere else. I would probably change the name from Anaheim GardenWalk to something more Disney though. But good sugestion.

[disneyfan07]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

:ot: the comment about downtown disney? I disagree. everytime I walk along the downtown disney stretch I think "WOW WHAT A PLACE!!!!!!!!!" the only way it would be dull, boring and sterile, if the buildings were all one color, one size, one shape. THEN it would be dull, boring and sterile.

okay now back to the topic: the anaheim garden walk? maybe go in 50/50: disney would in essence own 50% and (whoever owns it now, anaheim?, private investor?) would own the other 50%

[Uncle Bob]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

I think sterile was going a bit far too, but I agree with him that DTD is not nearly as nice as it could be.

[Bruce Bergman]

Re: Should Disney Buy the Anaheim Garden Walk?

I think sterile was going a bit far too, but I agree with him that DTD is not nearly as nice as it could be.

The problem with DTD is if they add too much more theme to it, they'll choke off the traffic patterns, too. It's not as bad as Fantasyland, but the walkways are barely wide enough for the traffic they're handling now.

Just remember Yogi Berra's wisdom: "Nobody goes there anymore - it's too crowded!" (There is a tipping point where you lose control.)

And as to being "Sterile", it really doesn't have to be 100% G rated, they just need a mildly heightened sense of decency and decorum - put the stuff that pushes sensibilities to the PG / R area inside behind closed doors. Disney already had to ask House of Blues to tone down the band offerings a tad so they don't freak any families that go in there not understanding what's on the bill.

I reluctantly have to agree, you don't have to scream the "Seven Dirty Words You Can't Say on T.V." monologue at the top of your lungs to be entertaining - going Blue (with your language) is either laziness or a last-ditch attempt to get attention for a comedian or band that's dying on stage...

(And if Disney's being run by that big a gang of prudes where you can't get even slightly suggestive in public, I'll have to dig up a copy of Jack Wagner's dry as toast 10-minute-plus "Etymology of the Word :!$#%: " monologue. That'll shake 'em up but good! :thumbup: )

If they built GardenWalk properly in the first place, it might not take much to "Plus" it to Disney's satisfaction. Background music, more trash cans, more sweepers and support staff, clear signage, all done.

Though all this expansion of adding the new hotel space and the new shopping, and the eventual TTP gate, would be a good excuse to start on a transit monorail system for the area. A grid that covers the Resort District and over to ARTIC to pickup Amtrak and Metrolink riding visitors, and eventually takes transfers to and from the regional monorail line heading to L.A. Union Station, John Wayne Airport and San Diego...

But that should be a seperate thread.

--<< Bruce >>--