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The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

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  • The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

    In answering an MC request in this thread by awkwardpineaple, http://www.micechat.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72446
    I started giving more and more thought to the current piratical state-of-affairs in NOS and now the 'Pirate's Lair' portion of Frontierland. Discussions have been had before (many, many) regarding the 'Curse of the Black Pearl' refurb to POTC, and its assets and liabilities, but newer additions to the Park seem to be contradictory regarding the 'cursed pirate' theme that is being adopted.

    Since inception, the POTC attraction featured a 'cursed' treasure, and warned all about its corruptive nature, and showed us all the consequences of enjoying these particular 'ill-gotten gains'. Since the refurb, however, the curse has been dismissed in dialogue (there is no longer any mention of the 'bewitch-ed treasure'), and we see Jack Sparrow enjoying the stolen goods at the end, singing about divvying up the 'loot'--effectively doing away with the 'curse', and the implied morality (intentional or no) of the original POTC.

    But with the introduction of the 'Bootstrappers' and the 'BilgeRats' in the Park, we see a return to a cursed theme. In addition, on 'Pirate Island' we see several displays involving treasure defended by a curse (and in some cases by the accursed themselves).

    So why the contradiction? 'Removing' the curse from where it belonged, and placing it where its appropriateness may be questionable? Is this more 'box-office momentum' we see with the 'newly' cursed Pirates? Could this be heralding a reinstatement of the 'curse' in the POTC attraction? Or is this wishful thinking? Are we all cursed to sail the POTC seas curse-free? I have my theories, let's hear yours...

  • #2
    Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

    I think it falls somewhere between the big CEOs not knowing what the ride originally entailed and trying to get the movie added to the ride. To make the ride almost exactly like the movie they would have had to almost change the entire ride. Luckily they didn't since the movie was based off of the ride.

    Personally, I don't think any of the big CEOs hardly ever think of the consequences that could happen when they implement their movie tie-ins to the rides. (Thank God Eddie Murphy wasn't added to Haunted Mansion.) This is probably the case here. The company got so wrapped up in movieizing the attraction they failed to acknowledge the original storyline. I still like the revamped version, though.

    Just my opinion on the matter.

    ...Joe...

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    • #3
      Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

      I am inclined to agree with JT on this one--is this a case of using the 'curse' when it suits them, and eliminating it when it doesn't? Do not underestimate the power (and entertainment value) of THE CURSE!

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      • #4
        Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

        Davey Jones is about cursed life rather than cursed treasure I suppose. The foreshadowing is still done since the attraction never really had much of a "you'll be cursed at the end of the ride" ending except for a few dead skeletons on the ramp out. I really do miss the cave dialog though. I found myself imagining it was there the last time I was on it, hoping that the cms would turn on the soundtrack for it if it's still lying around.

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        • #5
          Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

          How do the Bootstrappers and Bilge Rats reinforce the cursed theme?

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          • #6
            Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

            Originally posted by GhostHost2 View Post
            How do the Bootstrappers and Bilge Rats reinforce the cursed theme?
            The BilgeRats carry around 'cursed' props, and each character (they all have individual names and personas) has its own specific curse. The Bootstrappers have 'cursed pirate' songs in their performances.

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            • #7
              Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

              Some people around here curse those pirates and their treasure so often that the curse-lifters can't keep up.

              Okay, the real answer is: the supernaturalism of the ever-expanding POTC universe is increasingly convoluted. Some would say this betrays conceptual incoherence. Others would say it accurately reflects the genuine complexity of reality (and super-reality).
              "My mental facilities are twice what yours are, pea brain!"

              The conversation continues at Long-Forgotten, the blog.



              ......... .....May April March!.....................

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              • #8
                Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

                Originally posted by HBG2 View Post
                Some people around here curse those pirates and their treasure so often that the curse-lifters can't keep up.

                Okay, the real answer is: the supernaturalism of the ever-expanding POTC universe is increasingly convoluted. Some would say this betrays conceptual incoherence. Others would say it accurately reflects the genuine complexity of reality (and super-reality).
                I celebrate my Oklahoma lineage, and the generations of skinny nervous kinfolk that have gone on before me by saying: I like it when things are simpler.

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                • #9
                  Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

                  Originally posted by JosephTNielsen View Post
                  I think it falls somewhere between the big CEOs not knowing what the ride originally entailed and trying to get the movie added to the ride. To make the ride almost exactly like the movie they would have had to almost change the entire ride. Luckily they didn't since the movie was based off of the ride.

                  Personally, I don't think any of the big CEOs hardly ever think of the consequences that could happen when they implement their movie tie-ins to the rides. (Thank God Eddie Murphy wasn't added to Haunted Mansion.) This is probably the case here. The company got so wrapped up in movieizing the attraction they failed to acknowledge the original storyline. I still like the revamped version, though.

                  Just my opinion on the matter.

                  ...Joe...

                  Disney Co Execs may have decided a Pirates of the Caribbean film tie-in was appropriate/necessary in the park - but I'm guessing the Imagineers were just told "make it work" without much creative input from the suits.

                  I think the inconsistencies and contradictions in the updated attractions lies in the hands of a newer generation of Imagineers who simply don't understand the original intent of the classic WED Imagineering.

                  Gone are the days of "experience rides" that Marc Davis and his team created, and now are the days of force-fed story rides that the new Imagineering team is creating.
                  "We don't really have a story, with a beginning, an end, or a plot. It's more a series of experiences building up to a climax. I call them experience rides."
                  - Marc Davis, 1969
                  The problem with the Pirates of the Caribbean updates are that they added a story to the attraction that was unneeded. We didn't need to have a story about Barbossa chasing Jack Sparrow through the town to find the gold. It was entirely unnecessary. Pirates was intended to be one of Marc's "experience rides" - not a story ride. Once Pirates became a story ride, only then were inconsistencies and inaccuracies born.
                  Last edited by MasterGracey; 07-26-2007, 01:21 PM.

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                  • #10
                    Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

                    Well said and supported, Master!

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                    • #11
                      Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

                      I don't think the treasure at the beginning of the ride is the same as the one Jack lays hold of. The beginning treasure is cursed as we see the chest from the Isle de Muerta and it shows that there are consequences when greed overwhelms. Now some would say Jack is just as greedy, but his dialogue at the end of the ride express his willingness to share the jewels with his mates (ie. the people in the boat) while admittidly taking some for himself as a reward for finding the treasure. So the curse has never been removed.

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                      • #12
                        Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

                        JT and Master Gracey pretty much hit the mark I think.

                        The changes to the basic "plot experience" and thus "moral" of the original PotC seem to have been more to feed a current popular fad and were designed more for gate draw than with any consideration or knowledge of the orginal's intent.

                        The original plot experience apparently was "lost knowledge" even to staff (since I hear even park employees who train new hires say that grandpa banjo is the same guy in the jail cell...wow...just wow) and so it was easy to ignore something that most young imagineers don't know even existed (a real plot, moral story in the ride experience) and so to it was easy to plug in what ever "popular icons" they wanted to into it.

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                        • #13
                          Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

                          Personally, and granted I haven't been to the park in a while, but it appears that the imagineers had one storyline to tell with the revamped attraction, but didn't relay that to the people who handle the shows out on the street, with the actors. The scripts for both live show and attraction sound like the communication wasn't there for the scripts to be congruent with each other.

                          In other words, someone writing the script for the live show didn't get the email.

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                          • #14
                            Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

                            The Bootstrappers used to have a song about the ride and the treasure which they never mentioned to be cursed now. And since they were moved to the island there is no bell in sight so I wonder if they are still considered to be cursed or if that whole story line was dropped.


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                            • #15
                              Re: The CURSE has been lifted, but why?

                              Perhaps the treasure still is cursed. After all, at the end of AWE, Jack is still looking for a way for himself to live forever (Fountain of Youth), perhaps he thought this treasure, as the treasure of the Isle de Muerta, could also grant him immortality. I know, total BS, but it's worth a shot.
                              sigpic
                              Remember, Dreams come true!... and mermaids are hot, even on Halloween.

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