[Idea] Themin Screamin'

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This post comes from my previous thread on Paradise Pier but it has so much detail that I think it should be separated into a thread all its own. This is part of the larger re theming of the pier which I will quickly summaries. To come to what is described in this idea Tinkershmidt bought an old fishing pier with the idea of creating an attraction. He took the buildings which had been shops with living quarters on top of them and turned them into the boardwalk games and shops, and then on the (real) Eastern edge of the pier, an old boat shop once existed which was then turned into Screamin queue. The roller coaster was then built from this building around the pier where other rides were also added. For more detail on the rest of the pier, read this thread.


The Queue


Seeing as the boat shop had machinery already in it, he build the roller coaster here and it served as the loading area. The current queue and courtyard before the queue would be made into a deserted boatyard with a large rusty boom crane extending to a bay door on the side of the building. Boat parts and paraphernalia are scattered around the area also and the line would snake around the yard approaching the large shop building, entering it via a door placed just before where the current FP merge point is. Once inside, pictures subtly explaining the history of the location (and pier) would line the wall as you walk up the stairs, over and down into the loading area (Think Splash Mountain's quotes but pictures). The pictures would outline the past of the area and then a newspaper article would outline the purchase of the pier and its re purposing.


Orange: Shop, loading building for Screamin'
Red: Shipyard Area
Yellow: (Very) general routes for entrance and exit paths.

The Loading Area






The Ride

On the ride, you would roll down to the water as you do now, and then blast off. The explanation for the blast could be that Tinkershmidt wanted to make the ride thrilling so he invented a catapult system to fire the ride off. Puffs of steam could come out from under the track at an angle as the ride moved along for added effect.

Up the first hill the scream tube has been trimmed back until just over half way up. It has also been retheamed to a Victorian roof with either lattice or wooden walls on the non-bay side, while open on the other. The roof extends over the drop as it does now.


Notice that the tube has been removed up the first hill for a better view of the area (It looks so clean!).

Up at the break run where you are high up. Views out of the park are obstructed by the flume ride but any places where a view of outside still exists, a lattice wall similar to on the right in the picture below is constructed on that side of the track.



The lattice on the left would as stated be to block views of outside the park in certain areas while the mural on the left would be used on the main lift hill to block views of the convention center and act as a sound barrier. A roof would also be constructed over the track as the scream tube is now on the main lift hill. Aside from that, the ride progresses as it is now, (the third scream tube would also be retheamed).

The End

After the ride you exit the train and climb the stairs or walk out the back door as you do now, but instead you are still in the shop. You pass the photo purchasing area and then exit the building through an exit door close to where the current photo area is are. A short walk down a path through the shipyard takes you back out into the boardwalk area.



Comments?

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Re: Themin Screamin'

Hmmm... Interesting and cool idea. I do however have to disagree with your station theming idea. a shipyard doesn't really fit well IMO, at least for the Vintage Pier, it would cooperate better in Pacific Wharf. It could work, but it'll have to be pulled off right. At the moment it does lack theme, but the best bet to keep it in sync (IMO) with the new pier is a station much like TSMM. I do however believe an indoor structure would be an improvement, and some walls in-between the switchbacks on the queue so the boarding area isn't entirely exposed as it is today.

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Re: Themin Screamin'

Very nice! A few comments:

-I like the shipyard idea. However, seeing that Tinkerschmidt has bought it and repurposed it for a rollercoaster, shouldn't we see some decorations attempting to make it more amusement-y? For instance, I picture some lights strung around the ceiling and some murals on the walls. I think the exterior of the boathouse should be painted a bluish gray and white with accents of other colors, to make it whimsical but still believable.

-Moving the first scream tube farther up is genius! As you say, it makes for much nicer views and in addition it mirrors the scream tube on the other hill.

-I would try to keep the building as limited as possible. A single boathouse for a loading area is good enough, and I think the rest can be outdoors in a more garden-like atmosphere. An oversized gazebo would work nicely for a gift shop.

-How about a new exit to the launch strip? The rocks in the BSC model would be nice.

-Any ideas for the vehicles themselves? I'd love to hear some of yours!

-Soundtrack. Any thoughts? I myself was thinking that an improvement would be making the music a bit more orchestrated with strings and brass. The guitar could stay too.

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Re: Themin Screamin'

Hi Trevor,

Sorry, but you just can't remove that first scream tube. The laws of physics are kind of picky on this one.

Your idea to have a barrier further back ignores the fact that he sound waves will have radiated to an enormous area by then. Here is a picture showing the sound reflected close to the source versus farther away:



See, a backstage barrier would have to extend every bit as high as the lift hill itself, and would either be prohibitively expensive or an eyesore in its own right.

Your theme ideas are cute, but I agree that to be consistently themed, Tinkerschmidt would have repurposed the area. Also, a lot of the scenario seems to require explanation of a lot of backstory, and I would avoid this. You shouldn't really have to have a lot of explanation as to where you are--the imagineers might develop an elaborate backstory to guide their design choices, but to the guest it should just look like everything belongs together with nuanced details if they care to look for them. Actually stating all of these details as to why the loading area has boat hulls can seem belabored.

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Re: Themin Screamin'

Great ideas Trevor!
I like the shipyard idea, it gives that side of the pier a legitimate story.
Plus the location helps since the water "ends" right there.
I'd really like to see a new scream tube look like you've mentioned.
and I agree with WDITrent
any idea for a soundtrack, and what will the trains look like? And will you keep screamin white?

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Re: Themin Screamin'

Hi Trevor,

Sorry, but you just can't remove that first scream tube. The laws of physics are kind of picky on this one.

Your idea to have a barrier further back ignores the fact that he sound waves will have radiated to an enormous area by then. Here is a picture showing the sound reflected close to the source versus farther away:

[picture removed]

See, a backstage barrier would have to extend every bit as high as the lift hill itself, and would either be prohibitively expensive or an eyesore in its own right.

Your theme ideas are cute, but I agree that to be consistently themed, Tinkerschmidt would have repurposed the area. Also, a lot of the scenario seems to require explanation of a lot of backstory, and I would avoid this. You shouldn't really have to have a lot of explanation as to where you are--the imagineers might develop an elaborate backstory to guide their design choices, but to the guest it should just look like everything belongs together with nuanced details if they care to look for them. Actually stating all of these details as to why the loading area has boat hulls can seem belabored.

The back story wouldn't really need to be thuroughly explained any more than it is in other places in Disneyland, I'm just giving you the full story because I am the imagineer guiding the development. A few cuttouts from newspapers, a poster or too and some other fun pictures would explain everything the people would need to know. Possibly a plaque or too along the pier to explain the rest would be all else that was needed. Hell, there was a plaque explaining how the fry wagon in Disneyland got to where it was, I am not asking for much!

Regarding the scream tubes it is cut a little bit higher then it should be, but with huge thick trees like the ones in the viewing area lined up backstage, they can get around this. It can be done, Its part of my plan, and I dont really need paragraphs telling me that its impossible (expecially when everyone likes them. As a compromise, we could counsider moving the tube back down the hill a little bit while adding a mural wall to part of the rest of the hill. And the angles showin in that picture are rediculus! haha. A front on picture shows that if the tube came down a little bit more than in my concept drawing, the back lift hill would indeed be high enough to block the waves and trees behind it would work fantastically.

Very nice! A few comments:

-I like the shipyard idea. However, seeing that Tinkerschmidt has bought it and repurposed it for a rollercoaster, shouldn't we see some decorations attempting to make it more amusement-y? For instance, I picture some lights strung around the ceiling and some murals on the walls. I think the exterior of the boathouse should be painted a bluish gray and white with accents of other colors, to make it whimsical but still believable.

-Moving the first scream tube farther up is genius! As you say, it makes for much nicer views and in addition it mirrors the scream tube on the other hill.

-I would try to keep the building as limited as possible. A single boathouse for a loading area is good enough, and I think the rest can be outdoors in a more garden-like atmosphere. An oversized gazebo would work nicely for a gift shop.

-How about a new exit to the launch strip? The rocks in the BSC model would be nice.

-Any ideas for the vehicles themselves? I'd love to hear some of yours!

-Soundtrack. Any thoughts? I myself was thinking that an improvement would be making the music a bit more orchestrated with strings and brass. The guitar could stay too.

Alrighty. As explained in my other post, there are a million details in my head I cannot remember when typing these things out, but yes there would be tonnes of decoration. Lights would be string throughout the queue and on the old building, the indoor queue which would strech from the fastpass merge area over the tracks and down into the load building would be very clean and have nice pictures advertising the pier, subtly explaining the backstory, and just lookin damn good. Inside the main building, it would e cleaned up with lights and murals and all of those good things. However the back story such as the boat and a few hints towards what the building "used to be" would remain.

As for the size, I belive that my first post (which was made at 4am is a little bit misleading. I am useing old copy-pasted description and pictures and in actuality the new building would only be expanded to cover both loading tracks, with a little annex coming off to cover the fastpass merge area and the stairs. Out the back would be extended a few feet to cover up part of the track leading to the station and thats it. I personally would leave the picture booth seperate as is but I realize in the post that is not what is explained (well, now it is).

How could I forget the vehicles!! They would be modified and painted to look like a real wooden coaster cart (square except for the front car). The OTSR would need to stay due to the coasters design but It would look much better with a slightly more boxy traditional look.

As for the soundtrack, I love the current one but I would just take that score and rerecord it with a band organ or as you stated, an orchastra.

Hmmm... Interesting and cool idea. I do however have to disagree with your station theming idea. a shipyard doesn't really fit well IMO, at least for the Vintage Pier, it would cooperate better in Pacific Wharf. It could work, but it'll have to be pulled off right. At the moment it does lack theme, but the best bet to keep it in sync (IMO) with the new pier is a station much like TSMM. I do however believe an indoor structure would be an improvement, and some walls in-between the switchbacks on the queue so the boarding area isn't entirely exposed as it is today.

I will admit that this was idea was formulated before the pure victorian elements of the piers new direction were realized, but what this post does not explain too well is that the area by screamin would be more wharf-y in keeping with the new ariels grotto i imagined in my other thread, while the rest of the pier would be very Victorian. The transition would be smoothed by the old carousel area where it would turn to foilage before leading into the wharf style of the screamin queue. Also, to keep the area open, I personally would keep the queue open as it is but add in more theming.


Lastly. I would keep ti white but treat the supports to give them a more paited solid wood look. And as everyone should agree, the golden suns come off! Sure most wooden coasters are brown, but this is not the average wooden coaster!

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Re: Themin Screamin'

Lastly. I would keep ti white but treat the supports to give them a more paited solid wood look. And as everyone should agree, the golden suns come off! Sure most wooden coasters are brown, but this is not the average wooden coaster!

I really like this idea.
Actually, a lot of wooden coasters are painted... Colossus for one. I can definitely imagine Cali Screamin' donning the appearance of Colossus for sure.

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Re: Themin Screamin'

The concept for the queue theming is growing on me, actually. One thing, though, you would want to make the tone of the plaques, pictures, etc. be directed to a Victorian audience--i.e. something that they would be interested in seeing as they visited a park, not as an explanation for a modern guest. A great way to do this would be to focus on the coaster as a technical marvel...the Victorians had quite a mania for technology, so focusing the queue on impressing visitors with how this latest & greatest came into being could be a useful vehicle for establishing theme. These could be done as old posters/advertisements with amusing woodcuts and those little hands that pointed to all the important points. (I'd love to see the Victorian send-up of "you must be free of neck or back problems and expectant mothers should not ride." Although, about that last point, they'd probably be soooo euphemistic that it wouldn't even communicate anything to a modern audience )

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Re: Themin Screamin'

^

This would mesh well with an idea I had a while back about the pier being taken over by a World's Fair-type exhibition. Screamin's queue would be an exhibit of the latest inventions of an eccentric professor (possibly Ludwig von Drake). The coaster itself would be framed as a fun way to allow the public to experience the professor's latest discoveries firsthand - such as the "ahead of it's time" magnetic power launch (with steampunked-out machinery somewhere around the launch area).

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Re: Themin Screamin'

The concept for the queue theming is growing on me, actually. One thing, though, you would want to make the tone of the plaques, pictures, etc. be directed to a Victorian audience--i.e. something that they would be interested in seeing as they visited a park, not as an explanation for a modern guest. A great way to do this would be to focus on the coaster as a technical marvel...the Victorians had quite a mania for technology, so focusing the queue on impressing visitors with how this latest & greatest came into being could be a useful vehicle for establishing theme. These could be done as old posters/advertisements with amusing woodcuts and those little hands that pointed to all the important points. (I'd love to see the Victorian send-up of "you must be free of neck or back problems and expectant mothers should not ride." Although, about that last point, they'd probably be soooo euphemistic that it wouldn't even communicate anything to a modern audience )

Absolutly! This is exactly what I have in mind.

^

This would mesh well with an idea I had a while back about the pier being taken over by a World's Fair-type exhibition. Screamin's queue would be an exhibit of the latest inventions of an eccentric professor (possibly Ludwig von Drake). The coaster itself would be framed as a fun way to allow the public to experience the professor's latest discoveries firsthand - such as the "ahead of it's time" magnetic power launch (with steampunked-out machinery somewhere around the launch area).

I tried to follow the ideas already in place that WDI is working with, but your ideas are definitly interesting. (I wont fly into my rant about my dislike for "Steampunk")

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Re: Themin Screamin'

I tried to follow the ideas already in place that WDI is working with, but your ideas are definitly interesting. (I wont fly into my rant about my dislike for "Steampunk")

Thanks!

I like steampunk sometimes, but in this case it would probably be heavy on the "steam" and light on the "punk" - just something that would be vaguely conceivable as a period machine that would do what the unseen modern propulsion system on the ride does. With some giant horseshoe-shaped magnets and spinning clockworks and things that throw off sparks once in a while .

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Re: Themin Screamin'

i kinda thought that paradise pier was suppose to be like a boardwalk for example the santa cruz boardwalk (although i've never been there)

so i thought screamin' was already themed to the boardwalk like theme kind of thingy theme. (yes i added a few extra words)

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Re: Themin Screamin'

^^Much more steam, much less punk. haha

Personally I don't see the need to have giant machnery around the launch, but I was considering putting in blasts of steam that would shoot out from under the train as it fired along the launch track

\=/ The = is the train and the / is the steam firing out at an angle. That would be cool, and it would make the mist that sprays on the track between launches make more sense.

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Re: Themin Screamin'

I don't like the whole boat house idea, sorry. It just seems to add a whole layer of theming that is unnecessary and confusing. It's a boardwalk coaster, that's all it needs to be, and it should celebrate what it is. I would much more like the idea of playing up the mechanicl marvel angle which I think supports the nature of the ride itself and ties in well with the style and feeling of the era and what I think PP should be trying to express. I think big mechanics and gears at the launch would look awesome, it would screen the view of the modern mechanics and give something cool to look at while watching the trains launch. I think that would also give a really cool direction to take the queue and add a more cohesive theme which could tie Tinkerschmidt in perfectly.

I also don't think there's room for a mansion in the grotto and you can't change the curve of the walkway or it would be too steep. I also wouldn't really want the Wharf theming bleeding over into PP that far. I also think it would be best to leave the scream tubes where they are and just come up with a way to add theming elements to cover them and make them look more victorian.

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Re: Themin Screamin'

I don't like the whole boat house idea, sorry. It just seems to add a whole layer of theming that is unnecessary and confusing. It's a boardwalk coaster, that's all it needs to be, and it should celebrate what it is. I would much more like the idea of playing up the mechanicl marvel angle which I think supports the nature of the ride itself and ties in well with the style and feeling of the era and what I think PP should be trying to express. I think big mechanics and gears at the launch would look awesome, it would screen the view of the modern mechanics and give something cool to look at while watching the trains launch. I think that would also give a really cool direction to take the queue and add a more cohesive theme which could tie Tinkerschmidt in perfectly.

I also don't think there's room for a mansion in the grotto and you can't change the curve of the walkway or it would be too steep. I also wouldn't really want the Wharf theming bleeding over into PP that far. I also think it would be best to leave the scream tubes where they are and just come up with a way to add theming elements to cover them and make them look more victorian.

Haha not my biggest fan eh? For the pier to go straight across the area, it would have to have stairs and a ramp leading up to it. If it were straitened, it would then leave a little bit of room. The "mansion" would really only be a fascade of a mansion which could really be anything. I just want something there for depth instead of that boring curved wall.

I just tried to think of a creative way to theme the queue in a style as interesting as something at DisneySea. Sure, the ride remains a pier rollercoaster, but its origins and backstory are, and shouldnt just be run of the mill, they should be at Disney's level of extraordinary.

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Re: Themin Screamin'

Maybe I am the only one that doesn't understand why a coaster was built in a boathouse....

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Re: Themin Screamin'

Maybe I am the only one that doesn't understand why a coaster was built in a boathouse....

You're not alone. I think as the Pier is now, it would make little to no sense. Now, if Paradise Pier all had that feel, it would be an interesting theme. That Gustav had taken a fairly shipping/fishing dedicated dock area and turned it into a theme park. Bait Shops rethemed as food stands. Screamin's queue being a boathouse, masts being used for some of Screamin's supports, stores themed as ex packing houses and such. It would be interesting.

But as the theme is now, a low key sleepy little boardwalk with businesses on the street level and living quarters up top, a boathouse wouldn't really mix into it. The current theme for the pier is somewhat limiting because it is themed so exclusively to what it is. It's a pier-side park themed to a pier-side park in the 30's. Not much you can do to layer the theming of carnival attractions.

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Re: Themin Screamin'

I just tried to think of a creative way to theme the queue in a style as interesting as something at DisneySea. Sure, the ride remains a pier rollercoaster, but its origins and backstory are, and shouldnt just be run of the mill, they should be at Disney's level of extraordinary.

But this isn't as interesting as something at Tokyo DisneySea. You have to understand, what makes something interesting is simple, but has an insane backstory if go further back. Your example requires you to go further back to understand the backstory. It isn't simple. You have overcomplicated the simplicity that makes Disney, well Disney.

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Re: Themin Screamin'

The term boathouse which came into use throughout this thread is a little bit misleading. It would be more of a drydock or shop than a boathouse as it is a mechanical building, not just one simply for holding a boat.

Maybe I am the only one that doesn't understand why a coaster was built in a boathouse....

You're not alone. I think as the Pier is now, it would make little to no sense. Now, if Paradise Pier all had that feel, it would be an interesting theme. That Gustav had taken a fairly shipping/fishing dedicated dock area and turned it into a theme park. Bait Shops retheamed as food stands. Screamin queue being a boathouse, masts being used for some of Screamin supports, stores themed as ex packing houses and such. It would be interesting.

But as the theme is now, a low key sleepy little boardwalk with businesses on the street level and living quarters up top, a boathouse wouldn't really mix into it. The current theme for the pier is somewhat limiting because it is themed so exclusively to what it is. It's a pier-side park themed to a pier-side park in the 30's. Not much you can do to layer the theming of carnival attractions.

See originally this idea was in a thread that discussed theme changes to all of Paradise Pier, and now I wonder if removing it from that context was a poor choice. Basically I took the pier in that direction giving all of the boardwalk games and such the back story that they were also re purposed pier buildings bought by the proprietor. It would be distanced from the other end of the pier because the carousel would have been moved out where it could take on its more industrial look.

Now, to arrive at the shop idea I was pondering how the queue of a roller coaster themed as an older roller coaster could be done in a unique and detailed way that would give it a cool story and more depth than it just being a roller coaster with a boring queue like we have now. Would it make more sense for the queue to have been given an elaborate Victorian structure? I doubt any owner would build that just for a loading building. For a ride themed as Screamin' is, to follow the theme of the area it would just receive an open queue and loading area like it has now,

So, with that on my mind, I needed a building found on a pier that was connected to the water and could contain the mechanical parts
needed to make a "mechanical marvel" (I was avoiding that term but I guess it works). I thought about all kinds of things but for a man who many people think should be interested in tinkering, a boat shop seemed to fit pretty well. The rest of the coaster would have been built as normal coasters of the period were with wooden supports. Thats how that idea came to be. This thread is really just a supplement to that other thread (found through a link in my signature).

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Re: Themin Screamin'

Haha not my biggest fan eh? For the pier to go straight across the area, it would have to have stairs and a ramp leading up to it. If it were straitened, it would then leave a little bit of room. The "mansion" would really only be a fascade of a mansion which could really be anything. I just want something there for depth instead of that boring curved wall.

I just tried to think of a creative way to theme the queue in a style as interesting as something at DisneySea. Sure, the ride remains a pier rollercoaster, but its origins and backstory are, and shouldnt just be run of the mill, they should be at Disney's level of extraordinary.

I wouldn't say I'm not a fan, I just don't think this concept is strong. I like many of your ideas, but I also have some criticisms, only because I while some of your concepts are good, the details of some of your ideas aren't practical or there are things you're overlooking. Design is a complex process, and it's not always easy to come up with the most efficient solutions and often one decision will effect many others.

I like some of your other concepts, this one isn't working for me. I actually like a number of you other PP ideas, but as I said, there are little problems I see with many of them. I can elaborate if you'd like, but if you would rather not hear the criticism I won't.