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  • [Question] Indiana Jones question

    I heard from a friend that there was a collapsing room in indy when it opened but has since been removed, can anybody verify this for me? maybe a picture or video. any details are greatly appreciated
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  • #2
    Re: Indiana Jones question

    You mean in the queue? Where the spikes come down? Or is it more collapsy than that?

    Yes I said "collapsy". You know what I mean.


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    • #3
      Re: Indiana Jones question

      Lol no i mean in the ride, i believe one of the recent in the parks or dateline Disneyland articles mentions it
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      • #4
        Re: Indiana Jones question

        Are you talking about the "falling ice" effect?


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        • #5
          Re: Indiana Jones question

          ^i remember hearing about this
          it broke a few months after the opening
          Take a look at some of my models I make at kolbykonnection.com

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          • #6
            Re: Indiana Jones question

            Originally posted by mratigan View Post
            ^i remember hearing about this
            it broke a few months after the opening
            MrsMonroe, if this is the effect you are talking about it was right after you pass the first Indy AA and see the bridge/overlook for the first time before entering the Mummy Chamber. A light beam would come from Mara and hit the area next to your Jeep - activating around 60 pounds of ice (from what I've read) to fall from the ceiling. This simulated the temple collapsing and crumbling around you. The idea was canned shortly after opening as the huge ice machine needed constant maintenance and broke down often.


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            • #7
              Re: Indiana Jones question

              Originally posted by explodingboy View Post
              MrsMonroe, if this is the effect you are talking about it was right after you pass the first Indy AA and see the bridge/overlook for the first time before entering the Mummy Chamber. A light beam would come from Mara and hit the area next to your Jeep - activating around 60 pounds of ice (from what I've read) to fall from the ceiling. This simulated the temple collapsing and crumbling around you. The idea was canned shortly after opening as the huge ice machine needed constant maintenance and broke down often.
              Absitiveluy - The Imagineers might know rides and shows, but they've never dealt with Refrigeration. They didn't have enough big ice machines to make it work - they would have had to fill the roof with an array worthy of a commercial ice plant to get one batch per transport. They simply couldn't make ice fast enough to drop it as each transport came by. Each machine takes between 3 to 5 minutes to harvest a 50# batch of clear cubed ice.

              And I hear they also had a problem where the fallen ice "rocks" wouldn't MELT fast enough either. Could have been solved by hiding a simple bucket conveyor behind the walls to get the dropped ice back up to the roof and back into the drop bin, and it could go around a dozen times before it melted away - but nobody thought of that while they were building the ride.

              I'll gladly give them the fix, even come in and help them debug it - if they'll USE it and get that effect working properly.

              --<< Bruce >>--
              There's No Place Like 127.0.0.1

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              • #8
                Re: Indiana Jones question

                Originally posted by Bruce Bergman View Post
                I'll gladly give them the fix, even come in and help them debug it - if they'll USE it and get that effect working properly.
                If only Bruce, if only.

                It seems to me that not only was the effect not thought through well enough at all (obviously), but it also may have been something they threw in last minute? Who knows, really. It would be cool if they could re-imagine the idea and add it in somehow. There has to be some way they could get the effect or a similar effect back up and running.


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                • #9
                  Re: Indiana Jones question

                  If you are talking about the falling ice effect that has been gone for many, many years. I saw it the year it opened and didn't see it again after that.
                  Merrily on our way to nowhere at all.











                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Indiana Jones question

                    Originally posted by Bruce Bergman View Post
                    Absitiveluy - The Imagineers might know rides and shows, but they've never dealt with Refrigeration. They didn't have enough big ice machines to make it work - they would have had to fill the roof with an array worthy of a commercial ice plant to get one batch per transport. They simply couldn't make ice fast enough to drop it as each transport came by. Each machine takes between 3 to 5 minutes to harvest a 50# batch of clear cubed ice.

                    And I hear they also had a problem where the fallen ice "rocks" wouldn't MELT fast enough either. Could have been solved by hiding a simple bucket conveyor behind the walls to get the dropped ice back up to the roof and back into the drop bin, and it could go around a dozen times before it melted away - but nobody thought of that while they were building the ride.

                    I'll gladly give them the fix, even come in and help them debug it - if they'll USE it and get that effect working properly.

                    --<< Bruce >>--
                    Who's your source? Because none of that is the reason for it's failure. The ice would collect at the release point, but would melt together into huge clumps. That caused it to jam the hatch that was supposed to open to release the ice.

                    Usually I watch these conversations from a distance..... but stop acting like you know how things work all the time. You've got good hunches, but rarely are they correct. I ask that you cease to pass off your information as correct answers. Thanks.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Indiana Jones question

                      ^I appreciate your information, but take it easy. The guy was just trying to be helpful. He said what he thought he knew.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Indiana Jones question

                        Originally posted by castmember88 View Post
                        Who's your source? Because none of that is the reason for it's failure. The ice would collect at the release point, but would melt together into huge clumps. That caused it to jam the hatch that was supposed to open to release the ice.

                        Usually I watch these conversations from a distance..... but stop acting like you know how things work all the time. You've got good hunches, but rarely are they correct.
                        What's your source?

                        Bruce was mentioning what he thought the problem was.

                        I ask that you cease to pass off your information as correct answers. Thanks.
                        Seriously?


                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Indiana Jones question

                          Wow. That escalated quickly.
                          Women, they make the highs higher and the lows more frequent.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Indiana Jones question

                            Originally posted by Professortango View Post
                            Wow. That escalated quickly.
                            Agreed!! Wow...

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                            • #15
                              Re: Indiana Jones question

                              is there a pov with the effect working????????????
                              Take a look at some of my models I make at kolbykonnection.com

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                              • #16
                                Re: Indiana Jones question

                                That sounded like a good effect. I vote for Bruce to get in there and help!
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                                • #17
                                  Re: Indiana Jones question

                                  Originally posted by mratigan View Post
                                  is there a pov with the effect working????????????
                                  I think there might be a video or two floating around on YouTube but it was a very short lived effect.


                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Re: Indiana Jones question

                                    Originally posted by castmember88 View Post
                                    Who's your source? Because none of that is the reason for it's failure. The ice would collect at the release point, but would melt together into huge clumps. That caused it to jam the hatch that was supposed to open to release the ice.

                                    Usually I watch these conversations from a distance..... but stop acting like you know how things work all the time. You've got good hunches, but rarely are they correct. I ask that you cease to pass off your information as correct answers. Thanks.
                                    That was a little snippy not to mention uncalled for.

                                    Also, Bruce remains technically right even based on your own words. He said it didn't melt fast enough. you said it would melt together into huge clumps so,... It still didn't melt fast enough, right?

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Re: Indiana Jones question

                                      Gee, CastMember88, hair-trigger anger much? :ap: I make a living figuring things like that out and either preventing problems or retrofitting as needed. Of COURSE I have to speculate about the inner workings of that Black Box when I've never seen inside it, but when I know what it does (and what it's supposed to do, which is sometimes totally different...) I can guess at the contents. And I'm pretty careful to label things as Speculation or Educated Guess.

                                      And when I get a chance to stick my head into that Black Box later I'm usually pretty darned close. Some people say uncomfortably close - usually the ones who are in charge of keeping it running who for some reason either won't or can't...

                                      First, it's really helpful to be able to observe the system operating as installed and see what's not working. There were days when Bob Gurr dissected broken Autopia cars and laid down in the pit underneath the Teacups platform and had them run it to see it run from underneath, what flexed and moved and was likely to break next...

                                      That was when he discovered the secret of Huck-Bolted Frames on the Autopia cars and flex joints on the Teacups platform - and it's the same with any industrial gear. If it's got large masses in motion, or impact loads, you have to absorb that motion and allow the frame to flex or it will break. So you make a place (or several places) on the machine where it can flex safely to absorb that energy in a controlled manner.

                                      We can't observe the Indy ice-drop mechanism because they already pulled it out. I considered that kind of problem with the main hopper too, but since nobody's mentioned it in the past I didn't want to go too far afield with speculation. But now that you say it was a problem, it can be dealt with...

                                      It would be easy enough to rebuild the bin to put a screw augur in the bottom (at attic height, under the ice machines on the roof) both to move the ice from the back two Ice Machines toward the drop hopper mechanism and to break up any clumps that might freeze and form. You need an example, go look at the dispenser on a Through-The-Door Ice home refrigerator and scale it up - Your drinking glass is where you put the Hopper and the Effects Drop.

                                      And it's most likely to clump when the bin is full and the ride is E-Stopped or shut down for the night - Just like the ice in your refrigerator's storage bin does when you don't use any for a day or two. So you add a timer and run the augur IN REVERSE just to stir the ice for 10 seconds every 15 minutes just to keep it from clumping on you.

                                      Industry has long since perfected hopper drop chutes that are reliable and don't freeze up, how do you think they build machinery to bag potato chips, frozen peas and Bagged Ice for retail sale? Luckily you don't need a precisely weighed amount for each drop, so one hopper hatch will do - but you /do/ have to run this all in a low-humidity freezer atmosphere to minimize free water that would refreeze in the wrong places (it Always Knows!) and gum up the works.

                                      Might have to add insulated walls and a few evaporator fan coils on one side, turn the Ice Hopper and Drop Mechanism room into a little Walk-In Freezer. Won't have a lot of latent heat to get rid of, so 12,000 BTUH (1 Ton) would be overkill, the mechanism motors are the only real heat source - but activity will spike whenever a Tech goes in there to work on it at ~1000 BTUH each working up a sweat, ~600 BTUH each at rest.

                                      And if it still has problem spots, you install a little spot-heater, a sheet of Teflon or UHMW Polyethylene lining the chute to keep it from sticking, or strategically place a Shaker Motor to thump the side of the bin right there. A built in kick.

                                      --<< Bruce >>--

                                      PS: Bruce L. Bergman, Lead Electrician - Westend Electric, 5737 Kanan Rd. PMB 359, Agoura CA 91301 - CA Contractors License C-10 #726700. We usually do Condominium Common-Area and Light Commercial repair and maintenance, but I'll tackle about any problem you can hand me.

                                      PPS: Juuuuuuust in case you thought I was feeding you a line of Bull.

                                      PPPS: Oh, and 3 jobs ago was Hunt Air & Heating, and I was the only one out of the 6 employees (and the Owner) who bothered to go get their Refrigerant Technician License when they started that whole mess. And I got out of there when I realized who would be getting the $10,000 Minimum EPA fine if anyone buying their refrigerant under my license # messed up - Me.
                                      Last edited by Bruce Bergman; 12-18-2012, 11:23 AM. Reason: Better add the Bona-Fides at the end...
                                      There's No Place Like 127.0.0.1

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Re: Indiana Jones question

                                        Originally posted by Bruce Bergman View Post
                                        Gee, CastMember88, hair-trigger anger much? :ap: I make a living figuring things like that out and either preventing problems or retrofitting as needed. Of COURSE I have to speculate about the inner workings of that Black Box when I've never seen inside it, but when I know what it does (and what it's supposed to do, which is sometimes totally different...) I can guess at the contents. And I'm pretty careful to label things as Speculation or Educated Guess.

                                        And when I get a chance to stick my head into that Black Box later I'm usually pretty darned close. Some people say uncomfortably close - usually the ones who are in charge of keeping it running who for some reason either won't or can't...

                                        First, it's really helpful to be able to observe the system operating as installed and see what's not working. There were days when Bob Gurr dissected broken Autopia cars and laid down in the pit underneath the Teacups platform and had them run it to see it run from underneath, what flexed and moved and was likely to break next...

                                        That was when he discovered the secret of Huck-Bolted Frames on the Autopia cars and flex joints on the Teacups platform - and it's the same with any industrial gear. If it's got large masses in motion, or impact loads, you have to absorb that motion and allow the frame to flex or it will break. So you make a place (or several places) on the machine where it can flex safely to absorb that energy in a controlled manner.

                                        We can't observe the Indy ice-drop mechanism because they already pulled it out. I considered that kind of problem with the main hopper too, but since nobody's mentioned it in the past I didn't want to go too far afield with speculation. But now that you say it was a problem, it can be dealt with...

                                        It would be easy enough to rebuild the bin to put a screw augur in the bottom (at attic height, under the ice machines on the roof) both to move the ice from the back two Ice Machines toward the drop hopper mechanism and to break up any clumps that might freeze and form. You need an example, go look at the dispenser on a Through-The-Door Ice home refrigerator and scale it up - Your drinking glass is where you put the Hopper and the Effects Drop.

                                        And it's most likely to clump when the bin is full and the ride is E-Stopped or shut down for the night - Just like the ice in your refrigerator's storage bin does when you don't use any for a day or two. So you add a timer and run the augur IN REVERSE just to stir the ice for 10 seconds every 15 minutes just to keep it from clumping on you.

                                        Industry has long since perfected hopper drop chutes that are reliable and don't freeze up, how do you think they build machinery to bag potato chips, frozen peas and Bagged Ice for retail sale? Luckily you don't need a precisely weighed amount for each drop, so one hopper hatch will do - but you /do/ have to run this all in a low-humidity freezer atmosphere to minimize free water that would refreeze in the wrong places (it Always Knows!) and gum up the works.

                                        Might have to add insulated walls and a few evaporator fan coils on one side, turn the Ice Hopper and Drop Mechanism room into a little Walk-In Freezer. Won't have a lot of latent heat to get rid of, so 12,000 BTUH (1 Ton) would be overkill, the mechanism motors are the only real heat source - but activity will spike whenever a Tech goes in there to work on it at ~1000 BTUH each working up a sweat, ~600 BTUH each at rest.

                                        And if it still has problem spots, you install a little spot-heater, a sheet of Teflon or UHMW Polyethylene lining the chute to keep it from sticking, or strategically place a Shaker Motor to thump the side of the bin right there. A built in kick.

                                        --<< Bruce >>--

                                        PS: Bruce L. Bergman, Lead Electrician - Westend Electric, 5737 Kanan Rd. PMB 359, Agoura CA 91301 - CA Contractors License C-10 #726700. We usually do Condominium Common-Area and Light Commercial repair and maintenance, but I'll tackle about any problem you can hand me.

                                        PPS: Juuuuuuust in case you thought I was feeding you a line of Bull.

                                        PPPS: Oh, and 3 jobs ago was Hunt Air & Heating, and I was the only one out of the 6 employees (and the Owner) who bothered to go get their Refrigerant Technician License when they started that whole mess. And I got out of there when I realized who would be getting the $10,000 Minimum EPA fine if anyone buying their refrigerant under my license # messed up - Me.
                                        :bow:
                                        Last edited by explodingboy; 12-18-2012, 11:53 AM.


                                        Comment

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