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  • Why the double standards????

    It seems like people are in favor of the Haunted Mansion refurb, but against the PoTC refurb, and on the same token, people are saying that Disney does not want to invest capital into the proposed Cars ride for DCA, because they are not sure if it will be a hit, but at the same time they are pumping money into a Pirates rehab that is largely based on two movies that have not been released yet..... So............

    Why all of the double standards?????

  • #2
    Re: Why the double standards????

    I noticed this trend popping up on a HM update thread. From what I can tell, the Mansion Maniacs seem to be convinced that their update is more along the lines of a technology upgrade only, that the story and plot of the ride is not going to be getting a major change. POTC fans see their enhancement as a massive shift in spirit and narrative, with the whimsical rollicking rampaging suddenly becoming live action marketing fodder for the POTC movie franchise.

    There is definitely a difference in the two camps. HM fans seem dedicated to new things, they love to stuff more and more in that place no matter how advanced or non advanced the technology is. They even seem to like it if it changes the entire ride, like the holiday makeover. Probably because the mansion is like an exhibition of gags, the ride can never have too many sights and characters to enjoy. In many ways, even the original mansion is not very concise with its potpourri of scenes, but the entertainment value far exceeds any doubt in the plotline.

    POTC fans join together in a purist/protectionist conservatism that is beginning to scare me. They really didnt want the change ten years ago, they even went so far to get incensed at the removal of a scene where a pirate spoke of sexually assaulting a young girl and then sharing her with fellow decrepits. Now, they have it wrapped up in their minds that Pirates will return like damaged goods, and this contention is assanine. Still, the fans cannot let go, they hate the idea of anything changing in Pirates, and that is kind of ironic considering Pirates was the original ride to break all the barriers with innovation and invention (boy, if only I could cram those two words together, I could save so much sentence space! But I cant make it work, it just doesn't go).
    Last edited by Mission Seagull; 03-11-2006, 12:20 PM.
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    • #3
      Re: Why the double standards????

      POTC the ride? hit
      POTC the movie? hit
      their counting on the sequels to pull the same audience as black pearl.

      cars has no precendent, no audience, no built-in pre-release fan base.not like pirates.

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      • #4
        Re: Why the double standards????

        Granted I have not been in on any of the discussions on this but I am against neither. I look at the deal this way. Rock n' Roll was fantastic when it first came out. After a period of time (due to many contributing factors) things became stale and stagnant. Then here comes the Beatles, Rolling Stones, and the rest of the British Invasion. They breathed new life into the music by bringing something new to the table. Instead of making an entirely new musical form alltogether, they added what they had to the stew.

        I am not against changes to HM or POTC as long as those changes are added to what are winning products already.

        Do you get what I mean by this?
        Originally posted by aashee
        We are 100% grade A Disney Dorks.

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        • #5
          Re: Why the double standards????

          Originally posted by fantoongal

          cars has no precendent, no audience, no built-in pre-release fan base.not like pirates.
          I saw some extended footage of Cars at Wondercon In S.F. last month and I wasn't impressed. I ended up walking out in the middle of the pannel because I was bored. I may not be the only one with the same reaction to Cars. Maybe that's why there is reluctance to put big money into a new ride.
          You can think I'm wrong, but that's no reason to quit thinking.


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          • #6
            Re: Why the double standards????

            The way I see it Pirates, followed closely by Mansion, are considered the pinacle of WDI's attractions. What also really sets the two apart is that there really is no connection to anything alse being done by Walt with movies or television. The Mansion upgrades are maintaining originality of the attraction' story. Pirates on the other hand is being based on sequels to the movie that is supposedly a sequel of itself. Just saying that doesn't make a lot of sense.

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            • #7
              Re: Why the double standards????

              I don't understand the double standard either. I'm a fan of HM and POTC as they are today, but I'm very, very excited about the changes for both rides!

              As far as a Cars-based attraction, I'm reserving judgement until I know more about it. I'll agree, it is risky to put in a ride before the movie is a hit. Doubly risky to put it in DCA. I'm hoping the ride will be awesome, and I have a lot of faith that it will be.

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              • #8
                Re: Why the double standards????

                Even if the movie isn't a hit - the ride could still be a lot of fun - although, don't we already have a Cars based ride?? Isn't it Autopia??
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                • #9
                  Re: Why the double standards????

                  Wow. I'm not going one way or the other here on my stance about whether people have double standards, but the fact that someone may be for refurbs on HM but not on POTC may very well mean that they're not as big a fan of HM as of POTC and it simply doesn't matter to them. While I'll agree that there are purists that are extreme, that can be said for any topic, anywhere, at anytime. I wouldn't call it a double standard though.

                  People are entitled to feeling powerfully emotional about whatever they darn well please. If that happens to be a ride that has been, more or less, untouched since opening, then so be it. Why trash them for it? Why accuse them of a double standard and why call their stances and ideas on it assinine?
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                  • #10
                    Re: Why the double standards????

                    To me, i'd rather have Toontown and Tomorrowland improved before spending money on HM or POTC.
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                    • #11
                      Re: Why the double standards????

                      Originally posted by BFJen
                      Even if the movie isn't a hit - the ride could still be a lot of fun - although, don't we already have a Cars based ride?? Isn't it Autopia??
                      Yeah, and they have the bumper cars at DCA!
                      I'm addicted and I don't care!!! :yea:

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                      • #12
                        Re: Why the double standards????

                        Personally, I'm looking forward to the changes in Pirates.
                        I would love to see the Black Pearl battle it out with the fort!
                        Can't wait for the additional special effects! And I too, don't
                        understand why some people are opposed to the enhancements.

                        PERHAPS it stems to the previous updates that have been
                        done to both attractions. Of course, little tweaks have been
                        done to Pirates over the years, including the controversial
                        REMOVAL of the Hidden Mickey, Pluto, Goofy, Donald Shadows
                        on the Sail of the Pirate Ship, THAT really upset me. BUT
                        even more people were upset by removing and changing the
                        scene where the pirates are chasing their ladies. Let's face it
                        DISNEY SCREWED UP ROYALLY with those changes. And
                        now that Disney is outright advertising the coming changes,
                        many people remember how Disney SCREWED up by eliminating
                        the chasing women scene. No wonder people are somewhat
                        dismayed by further possible screw ups.

                        ON THE OTHER HAND ~ With changes to the Haunted Mansion,
                        just take a look at the changes that have been done ~ The
                        Haunted Mansion Holiday ADDS to the fun and spirit of the
                        original Haunted Mansion, without adding gore and bludgeoning.
                        And most recently Floating Madame Leota is better than ever!
                        SO, previous changes to the Mansion have been done well, and
                        most people think that further changes would only serve to
                        enhance the attraction.

                        HOWEVER, I am concerned about some of the changes to the
                        Mansion, that appear to be forthcoming. I am afraid that these
                        will take away from humor that is such a big part of what makes
                        this attraction a classic.
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                        • #13
                          Re: Why the double standards????

                          i figure let disney change them all they want. I dont have to go on them if i dont like how it turns out. I think i will like that changes as long as i dont have to listen to eddie murphy laugh thru the ride. That would kill the HM for me.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Why the double standards????

                            Originally posted by Druggas
                            To me, i'd rather have Toontown and Tomorrowland improved before spending money on HM or POTC.
                            Now that's the first sensible argument I've heard in a long time.
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                            • #15
                              Re: Why the double standards????

                              Originally posted by TraceCub
                              Wow. I'm not going one way or the other here on my stance about whether people have double standards, but the fact that someone may be for refurbs on HM but not on POTC may very well mean that they're not as big a fan of HM as of POTC and it simply doesn't matter to them. While I'll agree that there are purists that are extreme, that can be said for any topic, anywhere, at anytime. I wouldn't call it a double standard though.

                              People are entitled to feeling powerfully emotional about whatever they darn well please. If that happens to be a ride that has been, more or less, untouched since opening, then so be it. Why trash them for it? Why accuse them of a double standard and why call their stances and ideas on it assinine?
                              Very, very well said. So it either has to be one way or the other? (or your an idiot?) Can't people feel different about the situations depending on the different facts?

                              One big difference btw (among others): HM changes aren't fashioned after a movie.

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