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Disneyland crowds. Can the issue be solved?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Natalie Price View Post

    Annual Passholder lines? BAD idea! It's the Annual Passholders that are the main reasosn for the overcrowding. Reducing their numbers is the key to reduce overcrowding.
    You should also try visiting during the summer. YES...the summer! People like yourself who come during the off season and experience the nightmare of the crowds tend to avoid the summer because they assume it's got to be worse. But during the summer many of the Annual Passes are blocked out. So combined with diminished out of town visitors, the parks are quite civilized. Trust me...you'll enjoy it much more.
    On the other hand, if APs were required to use the AP lines and not allowed to use any others..........

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    • #17
      Originally posted by micromind View Post
      If Wall Street ever gets the idea that smaller crowds consisting of full-price ticket buyers will be more profitable than packing the parks with mostly discounted ticket buyers, APs will disappear in about 5 minutes........
      I love what you say here. I've tried to make essentially the same argument in other threads, but I haven't been able to sum it up so concisely and accurately.

      Nobody at Disney wants the parks to be crowded just for the sake of having crowds. What they do want is maximum profitability. If smaller, higher-paying crowds end up being more profitable than the large lower-paying ones, then that is what we'll eventually get.
      Last edited by longbeachaztec; 03-20-2017, 09:35 AM.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by longbeachaztec View Post

        I love what you say here. I've tried to make essentially the same argument in other threads, but I haven't been able to sum it up so concisely and accurately.

        Nobody at Disney wants the parks to be crowded, just for the sake of having crowds. What they do want is maximum profitability. If smaller, higher-paying crowds end up being more profitable than the large lower-paying ones, then that is what we'll eventually get.
        Yep. For good or bad this is true.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Fctiger View Post
          As a person who use to live in Japan and went to TDR often, it is funny to hear how this is a 'problem' in America. What I mean is Tokyo Disney Resort in Japan is notorious for being super crowded most months of the year. It was never perceived as a 'problem' by OLC who runs it, thats what they wanted. Thats sort of the point. Everyone just accepts it there for decades now. They did building TDS which has levied it in the past years and now with two big parks there is more of a balance but the parks are still crazy crowded in general. Maybe a bit less but honestly not much.

          All I think that is happening is they sort of realized in the states they can follow the Japan motto and find a way to get people inside all year round. No I don't think its a problem because if it was a problem it wouldn't be packed as it is. All the people who complain about the crowds still go as they always have. Sure some have stopped going but because the issue is the crowding clearly it hasn't stopped enough of them from going.

          Now do I personally love that its packed, no, but I understand why. Remember there is a organization that puts out the highest attended theme parks every year. Most of these companies pride themselves on being at the top of the list, not the bottom. There could be a better balance but they will always try to make it as busy as possible. Thats just capitalism at work.
          I lived in Japan for a couple of years, also. I think there's some truth to your point, but I wouldn't take it too far. I can't imagine subway riders in New York ever being OK with the gloved "crowd pushers" they have at the Tokyo metro stations, for example, so it's not all just a matter of the American consumer "getting used to it." Cultural differences are real, and Anaheim has to pay a price for overcrowding that Tokyo never will.

          Up until now, they've decide that the price of overcrowding is worth it. But, a lot of us think (maybe naively) it will eventually change.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by longbeachaztec View Post

            I lived in Japan for a couple of years, also. I think there's some truth to your point, but I wouldn't take it too far. I can't imagine subway riders in New York ever being OK with the gloved "crowd pushers" they have at the Tokyo metro stations, for example, so it's not all just a matter of the American consumer "getting used to it." Cultural differences are real, and Anaheim has to pay a price for overcrowding that Tokyo never will.

            Up until now, they've decide that the price of overcrowding is worth it. But, a lot of us think (maybe naively) it will eventually change.
            To be fair, going along the cultural differences, Tokyo is one of the densest largest megalopolises on the planet. Yes their Disney isn't exactly in Tokyo but it's close enough. Even at its most dense LA doesn't even come close to Tokyo, so things are little incomparable on all ends.

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            • #21
              The crowds make a larger impression on the older Disneyland guests because they knew the park when it was not crowded in the past. If the way it is now is all you know, then accepting the way it is now is no where near as difficult as learning to accept the "new reality" . It is a loss for some.

              Something external to this situation is going to have to happen to bring about change. The management is not going to change this on their own for any reason.
              --
              http://www.bewaterwise.com

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by longbeachaztec View Post
                ...Nobody at Disney wants the parks to be crowded just for the sake of having crowds. What they do want is maximum profitability. If smaller, higher-paying crowds end up being more profitable than the large lower-paying ones, then that is what we'll eventually get.
                That's not what we'll get. No matter how high-paying their customer base, Disney will not lower the crowds. They'll still keep the crowds at the maximum possible, and post the profits for a even happier Wall Street. Disney indeed wants maximum profitability -- which means maximum-paying customers, maximum crowds, and minimum expenditure on infrastructure and staffing.

                There are three things that could lessen crowds at DLR: if the demand for Disney brands drops, if the economy tanks, or (God forbid) a major terrorist attack on the property occurs. In the case of the first two, Disney would use discounts, promotions and come-ons to maximize the crowds, while slashing its expenditures to the bone.

                "With the acquisition of Marvel and now of Lucasfilm,
                Disney may have finally found the grail. You don't need
                imagination or art. All you need is a brand."

                - Neil Gabler

                Comment


                • #23
                  One thing I wanted to add that I didn't see in this good conversation about crowds was that to a strong degree Disney also likes the publicity of a "crowded park". Crowds sound like good business. Which means I will steer clear of Anaheim, perhaps even Orange County entirely during Star Wars opening week. I am sure the more press it gets on how many have turned out, the better they will feel. Even if traffic is blocked more than usual and there are lines for blocks/miles.

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                  • #24
                    Its a proven fact that people spend more money on food and drinks when the crowds are packed. The wait is to long for nearly every ride, however they spent allot of money to be there, so they buy food to fill the time and happiness so they can still try to enjoy there time.

                    When the park isn't as crowded, there just isn't a craze, guests just don't buy as much and there is less people to buy stuff. The second guess there purchases more when there is space to think.

                    It's just like black friday, people buy stuff when they are surrounded by large crowds even if its not something they actually need or want. Even if it not that great of a deal, fear of not being to obtain something is whats happening.

                    The crowds are not going anywhere, and advertising for APs and giving incentives isn't going to go away until Disney recoups back to the numbers they want to be at for APs.

                    Additionally Disney bringing back to SoCal $150, 3 day ticket deal, they want more people in the park than what there is. California is the most populated state in the united states, they have a large enough market to be successful even without tourest.

                    They want it to be summer season, and Christmas break everyday.

                    Who could blame them, who knows how long they can ride this out.

                    Check Out my Instagram - http://instagram.com/bradinsocal

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by CoalingaLucy View Post
                      One thing I wanted to add that I didn't see in this good conversation about crowds was that to a strong degree Disney also likes the publicity of a "crowded park". Crowds sound like good business. Which means I will steer clear of Anaheim, perhaps even Orange County entirely during Star Wars opening week. I am sure the more press it gets on how many have turned out, the better they will feel. Even if traffic is blocked more than usual and there are lines for blocks/miles.
                      And another bingo. From the viewpoint of TDO, TDB, the BOD, and Wall Street, photos and press reports of traffic backups and sardine crowds bring smiles of happiness. None of these executives experience the DLR as a normal customer -- on the rare times they visit, they're ushered through the VIP back-doors. As long as the crowds are within the Fire Marshall's limits, it's all good.

                      "With the acquisition of Marvel and now of Lucasfilm,
                      Disney may have finally found the grail. You don't need
                      imagination or art. All you need is a brand."

                      - Neil Gabler

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by BradleyC View Post
                        Its a proven fact that people spend more money on food and drinks when the crowds are packed. The wait is to long for nearly every ride, however they spent allot of money to be there, so they buy food to fill the time and happiness so they can still try to enjoy there time.
                        Exactly. Which is why the combination of Fastpass, opening rides late and closing them early, and having fewer rides in the park overall, continues the Pressler M.O. of getting the cash customers in & out of rides and back onto the walkways ASAP. As in a retail mall, the more crowded the walkways the greater the chance the customer will be enticed to stop at a potential point of sale -- a store, restaurant, or ODV cart.

                        "With the acquisition of Marvel and now of Lucasfilm,
                        Disney may have finally found the grail. You don't need
                        imagination or art. All you need is a brand."

                        - Neil Gabler

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          So stop buying Disney Annual Passes and start buying Disney Shares! Then you too will smile when the parks are packed!
                          --
                          http://www.bewaterwise.com

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            I don't see crowd reduction happening any time soon. Even if they quadrupled ticket/AP prices people would save just to be them and go as much as they could. People do that now and I don't see anything changing that. Just my point of view. I agree with CoalingaLucy that crowded parks may for good press. Most people in America want what the other person has and going to a Disney park appears at the top of a lot of people's lists.

                            The issue as I see is more of a crowd control issue. People stopping in the middle of busy walk ways when they could easily pull off to the side. No real directional flow of traffic unless there's a show or parade going on or queues that spill out into walkways. If Disney could figure out a way to get just those things under control I think the park would feel less crowded.

                            I also think it's important to find your flow. What works for you and your party. Even on the most crowded days I have found the flow that works for my family and the number one rule is that there is no plan. Talk to enough people and you'll find what the crowd flow is at DL or DCA and you'll find out when the really large crowds int certain realms and attractions. When you do that the crowds won't be so bothersome.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Mr. P View Post
                              I don't see crowd reduction happening any time soon. Even if they quadrupled ticket/AP prices people would save just to be them and go as much as they could. People do that now and I don't see anything changing that. Just my point of view. I agree with CoalingaLucy that crowded parks may for good press. Most people in America want what the other person has and going to a Disney park appears at the top of a lot of people's lists.
                              When the yearly numbers come on attendance at the parks around the world, people on here make a big deal about it and even some take some pride knowing their favorite park is at the top or close to the top of the list. Some might not actually care to that extent but care enough to post, share and show the proof that parks are continuously getting crowded. To me this shows that these numbers do matter to Disney too.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Mr Wiggins View Post

                                That's not what we'll get. No matter how high-paying their customer base, Disney will not lower the crowds. They'll still keep the crowds at the maximum possible, and post the profits for a even happier Wall Street. Disney indeed wants maximum profitability -- which means maximum-paying customers, maximum crowds, and minimum expenditure on infrastructure and staffing.

                                There are three things that could lessen crowds at DLR: if the demand for Disney brands drops, if the economy tanks, or (God forbid) a major terrorist attack on the property occurs. In the case of the first two, Disney would use discounts, promotions and come-ons to maximize the crowds, while slashing its expenditures to the bone.
                                I think many of your assumptions are contradictory, and a bit unrealistic.

                                Comment

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