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ROTR was still not ready to open if hours long breakdowns is a consistent thing

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  • KevRus
    replied
    ^ Yup. It’s so bizarre, and a strangely cult-like experience.

    Goofy and some characters were out on Main Street dancing to music while everyone was quietly staring at their phones. People trying to cut in line for the turnstiles to make it inside by 8am.

    It’s totally weird and uncanny. I go to Disneyland to take a break from my phone, yet everything is “gamified.” I hate the whole system and can’t believe it’s still happening. Guests MUST be complaining, right??

    It’s probably a way for Disney to semi-artificially raise their daily attendance “clicks.” So gross.

    Leave a comment:


  • CM08
    replied
    Originally posted by SkippyXS View Post
    The boarding group lottery concept is a case where the cure isn’t any better than the disease. Disneyland since day one been: ticket = attraction access. The lottery concept favors savvy pass holders and is completely out of alignment with consumer expectations. I’m sure there a many people who visited the parks for the first time in years to experience this attraction and neglected to learn about the lottery and its extremely limited gamey nature. ROTR should have opened when it could meet customer expectations, that is to say, operate reliably enough so that anyone who gets in line is guaranteed a ride.
    Very true. It's such a weird dynamic during opening rope drop now, there is literally silence with everyone on their phone trying to get a boarding pass. No guest is actually excited to walk into the park... and the few who don't know about boarding groups are left 'in the dark' confused as to what's happening. By the time anyone can explain boarding pass to non-smartphone users the passes are long gone.

    Not to mention the lines at park exit gates at 8:05am with everyone who didn't get a pass to try again some other day.
    Last edited by CM08; 02-26-2020, 10:10 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • SkippyXS
    replied
    The boarding group lottery concept is a case where the cure isn’t any better than the disease. Disneyland since day one been: ticket = attraction access. The lottery concept favors savvy pass holders and is completely out of alignment with consumer expectations. I’m sure there a many people who visited the parks for the first time in years to experience this attraction and neglected to learn about the lottery and its extremely limited gamey nature. ROTR should have opened when it could meet customer expectations, that is to say, operate reliably enough so that anyone who gets in line is guaranteed a ride.

    Leave a comment:


  • whoever
    replied
    Disney opens quite frankly, the greatest attraction ever devised in ANY theme park EVER, for a line of business (the parks), which only generate 28% of operating income and it's down here/there while they work out ways to improve it. "Fans: This sucks!!! BUT... I'll go wait in line anyway". Disney (me and other shareholders) laugh all the way to the bank. Me as a consumer of the theme parks cries a little.

    Leave a comment:


  • BlAcKoUt510
    replied
    Originally posted by Disneyidol View Post

    Wait, whaaaaaat? So you mean Disney opening this attraction during their admittedly slowest part of the year wasn’t done to bring more guests into its parks - during slow season ? ? ?

    oh ok. 🙃
    Right?! Crazy they "purposely" opened this attraction during the slowest period.
    Last edited by BlAcKoUt510; 02-20-2020, 06:27 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tapdawg
    replied
    Originally posted by TacAlert View Post

    Was at the park yesterday (01/30). Park opened at 9am and yes there is a boarding group one. We were group 14 and were called by 10am. They wound up getting to group 96 and stopped boarding groups around 9pm. the park closed at 10. Groups starting boarding minutes after the park opened.
    Excellent! Sounds like the experience is improving. Let’s hope this becomes the standard instead of the exception.

    Leave a comment:


  • micromind
    replied
    Originally posted by Starcade View Post
    If I was Disney Park Management and I saw that Florida's ride was not only completed quicker with rumored cheaper materials yet was up and running at a better pace in a much shorter amount of time while not having the benefit of a previous version to go off of I would be raising some serious questions about my CA. RotR team.
    Me too......especially leadership.

    Leave a comment:


  • TacAlert
    replied
    Originally posted by Tapdawg View Post

    On a perfect day the ride opens an hour after the park opens. Most days, however, it has opened 90 minutes to 2 hours after the park opens.

    They do not start with boarding group 1, it’s usually somewhere between 10-15 is the first group number for the day but it has also started with much higher numbers on a few occasions.

    They stop having new guests board the ride 2 hours before park closing, the ride is handed over to maintenance long before the park closes for the day.
    Was at the park yesterday (01/30). Park opened at 9am and yes there is a boarding group one. We were group 14 and were called by 10am. They wound up getting to group 96 and stopped boarding groups around 9pm. the park closed at 10. Groups starting boarding minutes after the park opened.

    Leave a comment:


  • TacAlert
    replied
    Originally posted by WaltDisney'sAlec View Post

    I'll accept that it's easy for a lot of us to move on, and maybe we're making a mountain out of a molehill. I saw this thread as aimed at people on Micechat who might be planning their first trip to Disneyland in years. I'm not going to tell them to "move on in life" when they can't reasonably expect to go on a ride that they're paying for. Delaying their trip for a few months might increase their chances of getting on because the ride isn't ready for the crowds it's experiencing today. If someone flies to L.A. to try the new Star Wars offerings and doesn't even get to ride because it isn't ready, they should at least have a fair warning. Legal terms in a mobile app saying that you aren't guaranteed to ride isn't enough when Disney publicizes it as fully open.
    "Legal terms in a mobile app saying that you aren't guaranteed to ride isn't enough when Disney publicizes it as fully open."

    This applies to every ride. What if someone flew out here to ride Space Mountain and it was closed for the day. What is DL supposed to do for them?

    I remember going to Epcot over 20 years ago (pre-internet) and thought Test Track was going to be open. Turns out it wasn't. Was I upset? A little. I went on with my day and had fun. Someday I will get back and get to ride it.

    My point is, I don't let things like a ride that is not working properly, and clearly made aware there is no guarantee to ride, not bother me. I don't run to City Hall to complain or go to any websites to voice my frustrations. I go to have fun.

    Leave a comment:


  • Disneyidol
    replied
    Originally posted by BlAcKoUt510 View Post

    While I agree with you I do want to point out that this isn't a high-tourist time for Disneyland. If it wasn't for this ride opening, Disneyland would be virtually empty right now. So I don't understand why people are making a big deal that the parks are empty. Most people visiting the parks at this time are purely just here for ROTR, not too many vacationing.

    I personally feel like any method of handling crowds will upset one group and be approved by another. The other solution I could think of would be to let guests line up. With this ride being as complicated and stubborn as Hagrid's in IOA, I'm sure we would have run into the same situation with ROTR. I hear that trying to get on both rides can be hell, so the method used to queue people is really up to opinion there isn't one solution to please everyone. Hargrid's method does keep people in the park crowding the area until the ride opens though. I'm sure Disney isn't happy about people leaving the parks after an hour or two.
    Wait, whaaaaaat? So you mean Disney opening this attraction during their admittedly slowest part of the year wasn’t done to bring more guests into its parks - during slow season ? ? ?

    oh ok. 🙃

    Leave a comment:


  • Starcade
    replied
    If I was Disney Park Management and I saw that Florida's ride was not only completed quicker with rumored cheaper materials yet was up and running at a better pace in a much shorter amount of time while not having the benefit of a previous version to go off of I would be raising some serious questions about my CA. RotR team.

    Leave a comment:


  • BlAcKoUt510
    replied
    Originally posted by Disneyidol View Post

    Well said. Having been there just today from 7:00a to 1:30p - it’s almost as if all that’s happening is Rise. Also it became clearer that the boarding group strategy is affecting the entire park operation. Even today after all the groups were distributed - a throng of guests just left the park at 8:15 am or so. I even was able to score tickets to Olgas Cantina for 12:30p. The fact is all the machinations the guests are forced to attempt to go through over this one attraction is creating its own vacuum and whoever executed this plan this way should be fired.
    While I agree with you I do want to point out that this isn't a high-tourist time for Disneyland. If it wasn't for this ride opening, Disneyland would be virtually empty right now. So I don't understand why people are making a big deal that the parks are empty. Most people visiting the parks at this time are purely just here for ROTR, not too many vacationing.

    I personally feel like any method of handling crowds will upset one group and be approved by another. The other solution I could think of would be to let guests line up. With this ride being as complicated and stubborn as Hagrid's in IOA, I'm sure we would have run into the same situation with ROTR. I hear that trying to get on both rides can be hell, so the method used to queue people is really up to opinion there isn't one solution to please everyone. Hargrid's method does keep people in the park crowding the area until the ride opens though. I'm sure Disney isn't happy about people leaving the parks after an hour or two.

    Leave a comment:


  • Zorro825
    replied
    When USH opened their Wizarding World a few years ago, they had months of unannounced soft openings. There were signs posted at the front of the land that the entire area was in a "dress rehearsal" and could close at any moment. This helped them smooth out any bugs in their ride and help with the overall operation of the land before its big grand opening later in the year.
    Disney shouldve gone that route with Rise when it became apparent that they couldnt get the ride going for the majority of the day. This wouldve helped with real world testing while also reminding guests that there was no guarantee they would get to ride.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tapdawg
    replied
    Originally posted by CMARSH View Post

    Perhaps I don't understand how this attraction works?

    The park this morning opened at 8am and according to thrill-data, they are now (940am) at boarding group 25. Are you saying they still haven't opened the ride yet?

    During those last two hours at the end of the day, aren't they still boarding called passengers....they have just stopped calling new boarding groups? If so, it would seem incorrect to consider the ride "down" when it's still running visitors through the attraction.

    Regardless, even if you allow for the ride to be shut down an extra 2 hours a day...the downtime only increases to a mean of 24.1% and there are now only two days that were above 40%.
    On a perfect day the ride opens an hour after the park opens. Most days, however, it has opened 90 minutes to 2 hours after the park opens.

    They do not start with boarding group 1, it’s usually somewhere between 10-15 is the first group number for the day but it has also started with much higher numbers on a few occasions.

    They stop having new guests board the ride 2 hours before park closing, the ride is handed over to maintenance long before the park closes for the day.

    Leave a comment:


  • Eagleman
    replied
    Originally posted by Disneyidol View Post

    Well said. Having been there just today from 7:00a to 1:30p - it’s almost as if all that’s happening is Rise. Also it became clearer that the boarding group strategy is affecting the entire park operation. Even today after all the groups were distributed - a throng of guests just left the park at 8:15 am or so. I even was able to score tickets to Olgas Cantina for 12:30p. The fact is all the machinations the guests are forced to attempt to go through over this one attraction is creating its own vacuum and whoever executed this plan this way should be fired.

    There’s no way materially the park is benefitting overall. My group ate breakfast at the Plaza Inn Character Experience or whatever it’s called. It was DEAD in there. All other attractions all day had nearly immediate FP availability.

    Why does this matter? Because the whole premise would be to get more guests into the parks for longer periods of time based on enthusiasm to try to ride the latest attraction. But since they can’t ride it a) they aren’t even coming in mass b) the die hards are coming c) this attraction and its land is so not integrated into the whole package of the rest of the park - it’s becoming more and more like a two audience system not one. Marvel land will only further fracture the audience and divide it more. This isn’t about whether Rise is a great attraction it’s about whether it’s the right attraction for Disneyland overall and long term. After riding it today and spending time in the land again - to me it just does not gel with Disneyland period. Disneyland’s success is built on a cohesive experience so unique it shouldn’t be messed with. G E has added a odd imbalance to the park. Great attraction but wrong park.
    I been wondering ?
    what been going on in the rest of Park......you gave me the answer.
    Thank you for the report.
    I agree about this attraction , being in the wrong park.
    and sound like a park within a park .....IMO

    Leave a comment:


  • Disneyidol
    replied
    Originally posted by WaltDisney'sAlec View Post

    I'll accept that it's easy for a lot of us to move on, and maybe we're making a mountain out of a molehill. I saw this thread as aimed at people on Micechat who might be planning their first trip to Disneyland in years. I'm not going to tell them to "move on in life" when they can't reasonably expect to go on a ride that they're paying for. Delaying their trip for a few months might increase their chances of getting on because the ride isn't ready for the crowds it's experiencing today. If someone flies to L.A. to try the new Star Wars offerings and doesn't even get to ride because it isn't ready, they should at least have a fair warning. Legal terms in a mobile app saying that you aren't guaranteed to ride isn't enough when Disney publicizes it as fully open.
    Well said. Having been there just today from 7:00a to 1:30p - it’s almost as if all that’s happening is Rise. Also it became clearer that the boarding group strategy is affecting the entire park operation. Even today after all the groups were distributed - a throng of guests just left the park at 8:15 am or so. I even was able to score tickets to Olgas Cantina for 12:30p. The fact is all the machinations the guests are forced to attempt to go through over this one attraction is creating its own vacuum and whoever executed this plan this way should be fired.

    There’s no way materially the park is benefitting overall. My group ate breakfast at the Plaza Inn Character Experience or whatever it’s called. It was DEAD in there. All other attractions all day had nearly immediate FP availability.

    Why does this matter? Because the whole premise would be to get more guests into the parks for longer periods of time based on enthusiasm to try to ride the latest attraction. But since they can’t ride it a) they aren’t even coming in mass b) the die hards are coming c) this attraction and its land is so not integrated into the whole package of the rest of the park - it’s becoming more and more like a two audience system not one. Marvel land will only further fracture the audience and divide it more. This isn’t about whether Rise is a great attraction it’s about whether it’s the right attraction for Disneyland overall and long term. After riding it today and spending time in the land again - to me it just does not gel with Disneyland period. Disneyland’s success is built on a cohesive experience so unique it shouldn’t be messed with. G E has added a odd imbalance to the park. Great attraction but wrong park.

    Leave a comment:


  • WaltDisney'sAlec
    replied
    Originally posted by TacAlert View Post

    Great way to totally mis-read my post. Never said it should have the same leeway as the other two. And according to your math, it is operating at 60%. Not trying to argue here. POint of my post was the ride is going down. Big deal. Move on in life. Yeah, no one mentioned Chapek, surprisingly, because almost every post becomes a Chapek post.

    Also, WDW has been getting on a whole lot more riders. It's not uncommon to see their boarding groups at the end of the day around 150. The had one bad day. Who cares.
    I'll accept that it's easy for a lot of us to move on, and maybe we're making a mountain out of a molehill. I saw this thread as aimed at people on Micechat who might be planning their first trip to Disneyland in years. I'm not going to tell them to "move on in life" when they can't reasonably expect to go on a ride that they're paying for. Delaying their trip for a few months might increase their chances of getting on because the ride isn't ready for the crowds it's experiencing today. If someone flies to L.A. to try the new Star Wars offerings and doesn't even get to ride because it isn't ready, they should at least have a fair warning. Legal terms in a mobile app saying that you aren't guaranteed to ride isn't enough when Disney publicizes it as fully open.

    Leave a comment:


  • TacAlert
    replied
    Originally posted by WaltDisney'sAlec View Post

    Fun fact: you were the first and only person to mention Bob Chapek in this thread.

    More on-topic: We have insider Cast Member information about capacity, downtime, and maintenance procedures. When was the last time Disney built a brand new ride that operated at only 50% capacity after opening? ROTR is down 40% of the time with around-the-clock maintenance and it's not even at full capacity.

    Saying a brand new ride should get even more leeway than 43-year-old and 25-year-old rides is letting a bit too much slide. Breakdowns with new rides are undoubtedly understandable, but if we're being honest ROTR just wasn't ready for this level of opening. WDW's version has been open for almost two months, and they didn't open the ride until 2pm last Tuesday. With Disney's reputation, I expect better. We all should.
    Great way to totally mis-read my post. Never said it should have the same leeway as the other two. And according to your math, it is operating at 60%. Not trying to argue here. POint of my post was the ride is going down. Big deal. Move on in life. Yeah, no one mentioned Chapek, surprisingly, because almost every post becomes a Chapek post.

    Also, WDW has been getting on a whole lot more riders. It's not uncommon to see their boarding groups at the end of the day around 150. The had one bad day. Who cares.

    Leave a comment:


  • WaltDisney'sAlec
    replied
    Originally posted by CMARSH View Post

    Where are you getting the 40% downtime figure? According to the thrill-data site, the actual percentage of "delay time" relative to known park hours is much lower than that (looks like overall 21.7% to me currently before we add in today's good run). In fact, I can only find one day (this past Sunday) when it was over 40%.
    Originally posted by CMARSH View Post

    Perhaps I don't understand how this attraction works?

    The park this morning opened at 8am and according to thrill-data, they are now (940am) at boarding group 25. Are you saying they still haven't opened the ride yet?

    During those last two hours at the end of the day, aren't they still boarding called passengers....they have just stopped calling new boarding groups? If so, it would seem incorrect to consider the ride "down" when it's still running visitors through the attraction.

    Regardless, even if you allow for the ride to be shut down an extra 2 hours a day...the downtime only increases to a mean of 24.1% and there are now only two days that were above 40%.
    Sorry, I should have been more careful with my language. I interpet downtime to mean times when the ride could be operating, but for whatever reason is not. By that measure, we'd actually need to increase the shutdown time to 3 hours for when the ride opens at 9am after 8am admission and then cuts off boarding groups at 10pm with a 12pm park closing. All told, the average is better than 40% downtime most days, but the fact that has hit 40% downtime on multiple days is what I was referring to. That should never be the case for a brand new ride that has officially opened, let alone when Disney is providing around-the-clock maintenance at night just to keep it limping along.

    At present, the ride is still experiencing delayed openings on both coasts (as late as 10:15am at Disneyland yesterday and 2pm at Disney World last week), closing early, and with at least two major breakdowns every day in between those hours. It just wasn't ready to operate at this level. Frankly this downtime frequency would have been fine if Disney didn't pass off to guests that the ride would be fully open by now who then planned their vacations around it. That's what irks me more than anything. It just wasn't ready for this level of exposure, and guests get to suffer while Disney benefits from the ticket sales and attendance levels.

    Leave a comment:


  • CMARSH
    replied
    Originally posted by Tapdawg View Post

    are you including the 1-2 hours in the morning it isn’t open as well as the 2 hours at the end of each night it isn’t open? Those are down times in my book.
    Perhaps I don't understand how this attraction works?

    The park this morning opened at 8am and according to thrill-data, they are now (940am) at boarding group 25. Are you saying they still haven't opened the ride yet?

    During those last two hours at the end of the day, aren't they still boarding called passengers....they have just stopped calling new boarding groups? If so, it would seem incorrect to consider the ride "down" when it's still running visitors through the attraction.

    Regardless, even if you allow for the ride to be shut down an extra 2 hours a day...the downtime only increases to a mean of 24.1% and there are now only two days that were above 40%.

    Leave a comment:

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