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Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversary?

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  • #21
    Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

    Here's post #3:
    Originally posted by PBandJ View Post
    Stagnating? They're in the midst of a huge Fantasyland expansion, they're rebuilding Downtown Disney, and they are adding Avatar by 2017...I wouldn't call that stagnant.
    I would, if it's viewed along with in the glacial "growth" (mostly mold) of the last 10-12 years. Before you defend all that's been done since 2001, make a list of all that was opened at Walt Disney World from 1971 through 2000, then contrast this with your 2001 through 2015 list.

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    • #22
      Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

      Originally posted by jcruise86 View Post
      Here's post #3:
      I would, if it's viewed along with in the glacial "growth" (mostly mold) of the last 10-12 years. Before you defend all that's been done since 2001, make a list of all that was opened at Walt Disney World from 1971 through 2000, then contrast this with your 2001 through 2015 list.
      Oh c'mon jcruise, you can't realistically compare those two time periods and expect to have the same kind of growth. To expect the amount and rate of growth that can happen at a huge resort over the course of the first 30 years of that resort's existence (to the point it has 4 major theme parks, 2 water parks, multiple golf courses, a huge retail district, and close to 20 hotels) to the the next 15 years is ridiculous. Did you expect another two parks, another water park, and 10 more hotels?

      Look, I'd love to have TDO step it up and improve all the parks at WDW and plus the entire resort with other cool stuff (I liked your bike trail idea...that was you, yeah?). Hell, I have had an idea for a 5th gate for WDW in mind for a long time myself, but I know it's not a realistic hope. Point being, it's not like nothing is being done at WDW. New Fantasyland, the Art of Animation Resort, new DVCs, Disney Springs, and hopefully Star Wars and something new at Epcot soon is progress, even if we see it as slow progress. It's not stagnancy.

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      • #23
        Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

        I would agree that Epcot and DHS have been pretty stagnant, but not the resort as a whole.

        I think WDW is only getting this criticism in recent years because of how fast Universal has been churning out attractions. I would argue that the non-Harry Potter parts of Universal do not come close to Disney in terms of theming and quality of construction. And the Harry Potter sections aren't being built from scratch - some attractions were re-themed, and they have all the sets and designs from the movies to work from.

        I would love to see even more improvements by the 50th anniversary...Future World and DHS could use some TLC.

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        • #24
          Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

          Originally posted by Mondo Mouse View Post
          Oh c'mon jcruise, you can't realistically compare those two time periods and expect to have the same kind of growth. To expect the amount and rate of growth. . .

          Look, I'd love to have TDO step it up and improve all the parks at WDW and plus the entire resort with other cool stuff (I liked your bike trail idea...that was you, yeah?). Hell, I have had an idea for a 5th gate for WDW in mind for a long time myself, but I know it's not a realistic hope. Point being, it's not like nothing is being done at WDW. New Fantasyland, the Art of Animation Resort, new DVCs, Disney Springs, and hopefully Star Wars and something new at Epcot soon is progress, even if we see it as slow progress. It's not stagnancy.
          Glad there's another fan in favor of having WDW have a great bike system. (Post #6) Thanks!
          Imagine guests feeling invigorated, sleeping better, and coming back from a WDW vacation a pound lighter rather than two pounds heavier.

          What's being built at Epcot? They could and should fit in two more World Showcase nations ASAP.

          I don't want a 5th gate since they are making it seem like it's too hard to keep up parts of their four theme parks.
          Last edited by jcruise86; 11-09-2013, 04:12 PM.

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          • #25
            Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

            Originally posted by PBandJ View Post
            I would agree that Epcot and DHS have been pretty stagnant, but not the resort as a whole.

            I think WDW is only getting this criticism in recent years because of how fast Universal has been churning out attractions. I would argue that the non-Harry Potter parts of Universal do not come close to Disney in terms of theming and quality of construction. And the Harry Potter sections aren't being built from scratch - some attractions were re-themed, and they have all the sets and designs from the movies to work from.

            I would love to see even more improvements by the 50th anniversary...Future World and DHS could use some TLC.
            YES.
            Excellent points PBandJ! Though most of us are likely to be impatient with Disney in general because we love the parks and resorts so much and want to see fun and exciting new things as soon as possible, I agree that most people wouldn't be quite as critical of WDW's slow pace of growth had Universal not cranked out all the Potter stuff so rapidly, and executed it so well. And also as pointed out above, I generally agree that the majority of the rest of Universal Studios Orlando and Islands of Adventure are not as strong as the rest of WDW parks.

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            • #26
              Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

              Originally posted by jcruise86 View Post
              They could and should fit in two more World Showcase nations ASAP.
              I totally agree, and have mentioned in posts on other threads that I'd love to see Brazil, India, and Egypt represented in the World Showcase. Argentina and Russia would also make for great pavilions.

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              • #27
                Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                Let's see.

                - They spent a metric ****ton of money on wristbands and tacky garish PlayPlace queues, which inevitably doesn't add up to anything. Did putting these noisemakers and crap into the queue lines for Winnie the Pooh and the Haunted Mansion do anything to improve those experience? I'd say the opposite. Wristbands and reservations for Spaceship Earth and Muppet*Vision probably the most unnecessary and flat out ridiculous thing added to Walt Disney World since a show in pitch blackness where you listen to Drew Cary on headphones. I mean, what the **** are they ****ing thinking these days?

                - They keep tampering with the classics and rides that are already among the most popular (and always will be) while ignoring embarrassing stains on the parks like Imagination with Monty Python, vacated Innoventions, Wonders of Life now in the forbidden forest from Harry Potter, that increasingly dated (though admittedly okay for its time) Ellen version of the Universe of Energy, etc.

                - Most of their new attractions seem marketed towards little girls and made to sell merchandise or something...and typically aren't really impressive.

                - The escalator out of Space Mountain eventually consists of a plain room with TVs showing you escalate by. Why in God's name is that there? Is this Space Mountain or Sears??

                - Universal is building the attractions that Disney should be and utilizing much cooler properties than Disney, who is resorting to strictly girly Princess movies for the New Fantasyland and, uh, Avatar. What the...?

                I don't know what point I was trying to make here, by the way.

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                • #28
                  Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                  I don't want to turn this thread into yet another WDW vs. Universal argument, but i must say I disagree about Universal using cooler properties, aside from Harry Potter. Transformers may be popular with young boys (and men who still have boyish tendencies), but those movies aren't going to be respected in the long run. Avatar is pretty unpopular on these boards, but the fact is that it was one of the higher grossing movies of all time AND it was nominated for Oscars (and not only in special effects categories). I like Avatar and i will most definitely see the sequels, but you couldn't pay me to watch Transformers 2 or 3 after suffering thru the first.

                  Then we have Spider-man, which is a cool ride and a cool property....and which mostly appeals to boys, just like Disney's princess rides. The Brendan Fraser incarnation of The Mummy is not exactly a timeless classic...and plenty of Universal's other areas (like Toon Lagoon) are just plain embarrassing.

                  Let's see how WDW's upcoming 50th compares to Universal's when the time comes...I think Disney will ultimately have the staying power.

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                  • #29
                    Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                    Originally posted by PBandJ View Post
                    I don't want to turn this thread into yet another WDW vs. Universal argument, but i must say I disagree about Universal using cooler properties, aside from Harry Potter. Transformers may be popular with young boys (and men who still have boyish tendencies), but those movies aren't going to be respected in the long run. Avatar is pretty unpopular on these boards, but the fact is that it was one of the higher grossing movies of all time AND it was nominated for Oscars (and not only in special effects categories). I like Avatar and i will most definitely see the sequels, but you couldn't pay me to watch Transformers 2 or 3 after suffering thru the first.

                    Then we have Spider-man, which is a cool ride and a cool property....and which mostly appeals to boys, just like Disney's princess rides. The Brendan Fraser incarnation of The Mummy is not exactly a timeless classic...and plenty of Universal's other areas (like Toon Lagoon) are just plain embarrassing.

                    Let's see how WDW's upcoming 50th compares to Universal's when the time comes...I think Disney will ultimately have the staying power.
                    PBandJ, I like your style. You continuously bring up excellent points. :clap:
                    I think this is a point that most people overlook. Aside from Harry Potter, which is still very much contemporary and has yet to prove itself as a time-tested "classic," the great majority of Universal's rides are based on IPs that don't have all that much staying power. Not to mention, for what it's worth, that the Potter films aren't even a Universal films. Universal Orlando used to have some classics like Jaws and King Kong, but they did away with those iconic attractions. All they have left is E.T.

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                    • #30
                      Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                      Aside from Harry Potter, which is still very much contemporary and has yet to prove itself as a time-tested "classic,"

                      Wow, after FIFTEEN YEARS of 7 books and 8 movies, 2 spinoff books and now a NEW series starting Newt Scamander and we're STILL on this line? Potters fate is DONE. It HAS become evergreen. They run the movies EVERY Christmas on ABC Family. The books will be in print forever and when Fantastic Beasts comes out it will open up that universe again. Disney fanbois just can't accept that. But I'm SURE 10ft tall blue alien sex kittens will be remembered.......................

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                      • #31
                        Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                        Originally posted by PBandJ View Post
                        Stagnating? They're in the midst of a huge Fantasyland expansion, they're rebuilding Downtown Disney, and they are adding Avatar by 2017...I wouldn't call that stagnant.
                        I would. Fantasyland expansion isn't all that impressive. Downtown Disney is just shopping and places to eat, but it takes far to long to get there from the theme parks. And Avatar is less than exciting.

                        I think WDW is like letting old computers continue to run, rather than upgrade them. As long as they work good enough and people still can get their jobs done, why replace them? And there are plenty of people that are more than willing to spend their money to ride poorly maintained rides and stay in motel 6 like rooms that cost a whole lot more.

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                        • #32
                          Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                          Despite small pockets of activity, the resort is stagnant. Epcot has improved from getting worse to going nowhere. The Hollywood Studios, Animal Kingdom are rumored to be getting movie themed expansions. The Magic Kingdom just got a movie themed expansion that they called "the largest expansion in Magic Kingdom history (it wasn't) and only added 1 more attraction than they had before and a restaurant.

                          Downtown Disney Plan C is just new facades on stores and restaurants that are difficult for resort guests to get to and nobody wants to visit to begin with. The aging monorail fleet is breaking down all the time and there are still no plans to expand it or any other transportation alternatives other than buses. The DVC expansions at both the Floridian and Polynesian are only going to strain the old system more.

                          The resort is stagnant because there is no vision. Nobody has a plan for the resort. Some people have plans to add hotels and DVCs, some people have plans for the parks, but nobody seems to be thinking about the Walt Disney World Resort. It may get bigger, but it's not going anywhere.
                          It bothers me when people selectively edit quotes to support whatever point they are trying to prove.
                          sigpic

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                          • #33
                            Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                            Originally posted by swampymarsh View Post
                            Nothing confirmed.

                            Avatarland is going to drive length of visits up, which means they need more rooms to stay in. Also with the success of the Art of Animation Resort, we may see more suite hotels coming up.
                            No chance at all that one land will dramatically alter American culture and change our vacation patterns and/or dramatically shift the number of international visitors as well as their vacationing patterns. At best it gets people to give up time at the Magic Kingdom or Universal Orlando Resort, more realistically it gets people to give up time at the other Walt Disney World parks.

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                            • #34
                              Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                              Originally posted by lazyboy97O View Post
                              No chance at all that one land will dramatically alter American culture and change our vacation patterns and/or dramatically shift the number of international visitors as well as their vacationing patterns. At best it gets people to give up time at the Magic Kingdom or Universal Orlando Resort, more realistically it gets people to give up time at the other Walt Disney World parks.
                              No you're right.

                              They are just expanding and redoing the park in a big way to sell one more t-shirt and a slice of pizza.
                              Be Cool Stay in School!
                              Next year I'm trying for a summer internship at Stark Industries.

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                              • #35
                                Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                                Originally posted by JCSkipr79 View Post

                                Wow, after FIFTEEN YEARS of 7 books and 8 movies, 2 spinoff books and now a NEW series starting Newt Scamander and we're STILL on this line? Potters fate is DONE. It HAS become evergreen. They run the movies EVERY Christmas on ABC Family. The books will be in print forever and when Fantastic Beasts comes out it will open up that universe again. Disney fanbois just can't accept that. But I'm SURE 10ft tall blue alien sex kittens will be remembered.......................
                                Wow, someone's excessively sensitive over Harry.

                                First of all, calm down.
                                Second of all, I'm not a fanboi.
                                Third, being around for 15 years doesn't make anything classic. Not to mention IT HASN'T BEEN FIFTEEN YEARS SINCE THE LAST POTTER FILM. Books, films, cars, collectibles, etc aren't considered "classic" until a truly significant time has passed, and the fact that the last Potter film came out just a few years ago makes it relatively contemporary. Casablanca is a classic. The Wizard of Oz is a Classic. A '57 Chevy is classic. Star Wars is classic.

                                I never implied that Potter won't be popular 40 years from now. It may be. I don't know, and you don't know, and neither does anyone else. All I said is that Harry Potter is not yet time-tested, and this is a fact because there hasn't been enough time gone by since the last of the Potter films.
                                And I never said Avatar was classic or that I even like it, so again, calm down.

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                                • #36
                                  Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                                  Originally posted by Mondo Mouse View Post
                                  Wow, someone's excessively sensitive over Harry.

                                  First of all, calm down.
                                  Second of all, I'm not a fanboi.
                                  Third, being around for 15 years doesn't make anything classic. Not to mention IT HASN'T BEEN FIFTEEN YEARS SINCE THE LAST POTTER FILM. Books, films, cars, collectibles, etc aren't considered "classic" until a truly significant time has passed, and the fact that the last Potter film came out just a few years ago makes it relatively contemporary. Casablanca is a classic. The Wizard of Oz is a Classic. A '57 Chevy is classic. Star Wars is classic.

                                  I never implied that Potter won't be popular 40 years from now. It may be. I don't know, and you don't know, and neither does anyone else. All I said is that Harry Potter is not yet time-tested, and this is a fact because there hasn't been enough time gone by since the last of the Potter films.
                                  And I never said Avatar was classic or that I even like it, so again, calm down.
                                  I couldn't agree more today's Wizarding World could be Tomorrow's Honey I shrank the kinds or Roger Rabbit. Both were very popular and have areas at DHS but now aren't so popular. While I personally think its a shame Roger has faded (mostly due to legal battles) it shows that single theme areas aren't the best long term solution for a theme park

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                                  • #37
                                    Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                                    Originally posted by robbiem View Post
                                    While I personally think its a shame Roger has faded (mostly due to legal battles) it shows that single theme areas aren't the best long term solution for a theme park
                                    Yeah, it's a shame all the legal issues and tension between Disney and Spielberg had to happen, and has made it so difficult for there to be more development with Roger Rabbit. I would love to see another film, or at least new shorts...mostly because I love Jessica Rabbit and want them to put out new merch of her, hahaha!

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                                    • #38
                                      Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                                      Disney distributes Spielberg's DreamWorks Pictures in place of Touchstone now. I think they've made up.

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                                      • #39
                                        Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                                        Originally posted by CaliforniaAdventurer View Post
                                        Disney distributes Spielberg's DreamWorks Pictures in place of Touchstone now. I think they've made up.
                                        I've heard that relations are much better, especially since Eisner is no longer in charge. I'd love to them to work out all the legal issues concerning Roger Rabbit and produce some new material.

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                                        • #40
                                          Re: Is Disney letting WDW stagnate so they can revive it for the 2021 50th Anniversar

                                          I think "all the legal issues" was Eisner, so we're good to go.

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