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  • #41
    Expect a MAJOR theme park expansion in 2010.


    Disney just announced 2 major expansions to its WDW property: the 900-acre Four-Seasons Resort and the Western Development the size of Animal Kingdom.

    Now to take a closer look at the possible reasons why Disney thinks it will be able to attract enough visitors and fill up thousands of hotel rooms and time-share units, with the first phase opening in 2010-2011, it is reasonable for us to believe that the most likely scenario is a MAJOR theme park expansion opening in 2010-2011.

    I know some people don't want to see more value resorts being built at WDW, but if you look a this announcement from a different perspective, then you will see that it is actually a good thing for all Disney Fans because we can expect more entertainment offerings at WDW.

    The thought of a 5th gate may be too optimistic. I think the most likely case is a major expansion to Animal Kingdom (Beastly Kingdom?)

    Resort hotels typically take longer to build than attractions do. Since they announced the 4-seasons and western development today, we may expect an announcement of a MAJOR theme park expansion no later than spring 2008.
    I am the picture guy---A Picture is Worth a Thousand Words.

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    • #42
      Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

      I've remembered being told that WDW has used half of the land that they have room to build on, as well as the trivia about DAK being the same size as the other three parks together.

      Are they really going to use 25% of their remaining land on this value resort pseudocomplex? I'm not opposed to the idea in concept as much as I am the idea of so much space being devoted to it.

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      • #43
        Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

        Originally posted by MickeyMania View Post
        I've remembered being told that WDW has used half of the land that they have room to build on, as well as the trivia about DAK being the same size as the other three parks together.

        Are they really going to use 25% of their remaining land on this value resort pseudocomplex? I'm not opposed to the idea in concept as much as I am the idea of so much space being devoted to it.
        Half? Well, I don't think that's exactly accurate. To give you an idea of why I feel that way, here's an areal/orbital view of the resort property. Port Orleans is where we stayed two years ago. As I mentioned in the other thread, you need to take a ferry boat to get from one end to the other. While it may be one of the largest hotels on the resort, it's not egregiously larger then what they already have and still have room to grow on.


        Click Here


        I don't think space is going to be an issue. I'm not sure I even included it all, considering things like Celebration and how I nearly cut off the race track. (You can see it near the top left circling some Mickey ears)


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        • #44
          Re: Four Seasons to Anchor New Disney Luxury Resort

          Originally posted by WDW1974 View Post
          Great point, MM.

          And one that I've stated in many 'class battle' threads over the years.

          It's very easy to see when you look at the average WDW deluxe guest of 2007 vs. one in 1992.

          The makeup has largely changed as much of the upper clientele have departed as Disney has lowered quality. The average tourist from Alabama, New Hampshire or Kentucky may think they're getting a very upscale experience at the Beach Club of 2007, but the savvy, luxury traveler stopped visiting years ago or, if they still come, they're likely staying at the Ritz or any number of true luxury resorts that have opened in the past five years.

          That's what happens when you WalMart 'the brand.'
          I agree, its pretty clear what their line of thinking is.

          They want the luxury market, they weren't able to get it 10 years ago and have since lowered the value of their brand, so they sure aren't going to get it now. Its far cheaper and safer to make a deal with somebody who already does it well.

          If we are just accepting the fact that this is how Disney thinks and will continue to think, and that Disney is really no longer Disney, then I guess there is nothing to do but commend them.

          But I still just can't do that. They shouldn't be doing this. Leasing/selling land in WDW shouldn't even be on the table. They shouldn't even be thinking about the luxury market right now. There's too much repair work that needs to be done on their own brand from so many different perspectives.

          That's what they SHOULD be investing in. If you are telling me that's a pointless discussion because its just not going to happen no matter how right it might be, then sadly, I really can't offer much of a protest.

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          • #45
            Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

            I tend to agree with the Park expansion or new park idea.

            New hotels means that Disney thinks they can fill them up and the parks will need to expand to make room for new guests during peek seasons like last years nearly total capacity of three parks!

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            • #46
              Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

              Just what WDW needs. Another freaking hotel.:thumbdown

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              • #47
                Re: New Disney Luxury Resort Announced

                Can they just change the name of the place to "Walt Disney's World of Resort Hotels" and get it over it? The "De-Magification" of WDW continues.

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                • #48
                  Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                  it is reasonable for us to believe that the most likely scenario is a MAJOR theme park expansion opening in 2010-2011.
                  I don't think so. I think the current plan is to fix the current parks before starting a new one which is what I want to see done. MK needs several major refurbs, DAK needs one or two more attractions to become a full day park, Epcot is getting there but could use something new in WoL, maybe a refurb of UoE, and something over in World Showcase, and don't even get me started on the work MGM needs. This work, if they commit to it, will take much longer than 2010 to be finished. I think they'll get the current parks up to snuff before starting another park.

                  I think the large value resort area is only because they still see a market for it. Lets face it, there's still a large number of families who come to Walt Disney who still can't afford the current "value" resorts and many of them head to the motel 6's out there. I know there are trips when my family does. Disney's current goal is to pull everyone who comes to Disney onto their property and have them never leave the resort. This is a good way to do so. If they meet those needs of the "cheap" guests then that's even more money in Disney's pockets.

                  Personally I like the idea. It's somewhat removed it seems from the major, highly themed areas of WDW so it won't detract from them and it gives those of us on a tight budget or just on a last minute weekend trip a cheaper place to stay without having to go to Motel 6 or something like that.

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                  • #49
                    Re: New Disney Luxury Resort Announced

                    Those pictures are nice but they're not "magical" at all.

                    Comment


                    • #50
                      Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                      The only current plans that exist for a new theme park in WDW involve converting the Wide World of Sports into the first ESPN branded Theme Park. Anything else is blue sky.
                      -Dr. Nigel Channing
                      "We don't know anything... that can't be imagined."

                      "Keep Moving Forward"

                      Comment


                      • #51
                        Re: Four Seasons to Anchor New Disney Luxury Resort

                        Yesterday's news on both this and the Western Beltway is a dark day as far as I am concerned. Both plans are loaded with third party projects. Now I don't subscribe to Raidermatt's doomsday view, because I understand that WDW's expansion is just going to need 3rd party involvement from a cost perspective, but this is an awful lot to stomach. Personally, I don't care about either of these project, they don't appeal at all. But what I do care about is the obvious draining of funds to projects that I don't care about. That's unavoidable at this point
                        "You are not the first to pass this way..."
                        Mouse Extra
                        feeding the Disney addiction daily
                        http://www.mouseextra.com/

                        Comment


                        • #52
                          Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                          Originally posted by Dr. Nigel Channing View Post
                          The only current plans that exist for a new theme park in WDW involve converting the Wide World of Sports into the first ESPN branded Theme Park. Anything else is blue sky.
                          CAn you tell us anymore about this? Perhaps some source info?

                          As far as this thread goes, I think we are jumping way off the conclusions bridge here. Disney sees a market for cheap hotels, there all over the surrounding area. SO what better way to tap into that then lease the property and make some cash off that market? This is not a prelude to park expansion, it is yet another battle in the turf war between Disney and the rest of the local area.
                          "You are not the first to pass this way..."
                          Mouse Extra
                          feeding the Disney addiction daily
                          http://www.mouseextra.com/

                          Comment


                          • #53
                            Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                            Originally posted by TDLFAN View Post
                            Just what WDW needs. Another freaking hotel.:thumbdown
                            I actually have to agree with you here, TDLFan. And on that note, have a question...I haven't been over to Pop Century in a couple years, wasn't there supposed to be a second phase to this resort. As I recall the buildings are there across the pond but not finished. So why build another value resort...just finish that one?
                            Originally posted by larasound
                            am I the burrito man?

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                            • #54
                              Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                              Because they're not building a value resort, they're building a budget resort. These will be even cheaper than the values.

                              Comment


                              • #55
                                Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                                Wow. Looks like it's to start getting cramped at WDW. It won't be too long and things will start to look like Harbor and Katella...

                                Comment


                                • #56
                                  Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                                  Originally posted by TDLFAN View Post
                                  Just what WDW needs. Another freaking hotel.:thumbdown

                                  And more buses!

                                  Comment


                                  • #57
                                    Re: New Disney Luxury Resort Announced

                                    Whats with the (57 ?) Chevy parked at the Value hotels?

                                    Are people are drivng the classic cars on vacation now.

                                    -dave
                                    "I'm gonna build my own amusement park. But with gambling and hookers!" - Bender
                                    "You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity." - Bullet Tooth Tony

                                    Comment


                                    • #58
                                      Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                                      Originally posted by kcnole View Post
                                      Because they're not building a value resort, they're building a budget resort. These will be even cheaper than the values.

                                      Yes, my guess, and its only a guess, is these will simply be chain hotels on property.

                                      No themeing, no Disney services, maybe no delivery of park purchases.

                                      I would hazard a guess that Disney has taken a hands off approach to managing these.

                                      Look at it this way. Disney works out some sort of payment schedule - lease the land plus some cut of the income and the hotels run themselves.

                                      Disney has a positive cash flow, and no expenses. They don't ahve the headaches and expense of staffing the hotels. They can justify not providing the "Disney magic" because a) its not Disney branded, and b) its a cut rate price. The just sit back and collect rent and royalities.

                                      At the 4S - is anybody going to care that they cannot buy a mickey head rice krispie treat - most likely no. And any way, with the level of service the 4S provides, the concierge provided by the 4S staff would arrange for one to be sent to your room.

                                      -dave
                                      "I'm gonna build my own amusement park. But with gambling and hookers!" - Bender
                                      "You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity." - Bullet Tooth Tony

                                      Comment


                                      • #59
                                        Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                                        Originally posted by kcnole View Post
                                        Because they're not building a value resort, they're building a budget resort. These will be even cheaper than the values.
                                        How can that be good? I mean, is it really necessary?

                                        Originally posted by Phonedave View Post
                                        Yes, my guess, and its only a guess, is these will simply be chain hotels on property.

                                        No themeing, no Disney services, maybe no delivery of park purchases.

                                        I would hazard a guess that Disney has taken a hands off approach to managing these.

                                        Look at it this way. Disney works out some sort of payment schedule - lease the land plus some cut of the income and the hotels run themselves.

                                        Disney has a positive cash flow, and no expenses. They don't ahve the headaches and expense of staffing the hotels. They can justify not providing the "Disney magic" because a) its not Disney branded, and b) its a cut rate price. The just sit back and collect rent and royalities.

                                        At the 4S - is anybody going to care that they cannot buy a mickey head rice krispie treat - most likely no. And any way, with the level of service the 4S provides, the concierge provided by the 4S staff would arrange for one to be sent to your room.

                                        -dave
                                        But won't this cheapen the Disney image?
                                        Originally posted by larasound
                                        am I the burrito man?

                                        Comment


                                        • #60
                                          Re: Expect a MAJOR them park expansion in 2010.

                                          not really because as far as the guest are concerned they are not on property as they will be outside the gate. No different than the hotels that line property on 535 such as the Doubletree and the old Days Inn.

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