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Just hit me: Disney is NOT making more monorails

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  • #16
    Originally posted by ORD84 View Post
    This Blog about Gondolas where I read more about Disney's (if you get into the comments they even discuss updated type of gondola model etc.) States that they will have wifi and large windows like the one in Singapore. I don't know why you would provide wifi, but no AC...I would think that comfort of guests would be more paramount than internet connectivity.
    Because the power requirements for AC are dramatically higher then are needed to WiFi. I don't know that they would even need Wifi in the cars, the could put the access points at each of the towers. Even if they did put it in the cars a solar panel and some batteries would probably be sufficient for Wifi.


    • #17
      Anyone remember Disney's attempt decades ago to run a monorail spur from the Orlando Airport (MCO) to WDW? It was an EPIC battle. The city complained bitterly that this would prevent local businesses from having access to Disney Guests and as a result, (they claimed) many non-Disney jobs would be lost, along with local tax revenue for Orlando. Disney tried for years to get the city fathers to see reason, but Orlando wouldn't budge. So, Disney gave Orlando the billion dollar middle finger and put in place the same sort of system to transport Guests unmolested from the airport to WDW but using buses instead of monorails, which Orlando couldn't interfere with. But this outcome was apparently was the figurative "wooden stake" through the heart of the monorail. Had the line to MCO been built, other expansions would likely have followed as costs per monorail and cost of the concrete rails would have gone down simply due to economy of scale. (since more are made, the cost per unit goes down.) Lift a glass to what "Might Have Been" and to the mid-century modernism style of design Walt loved so very much.


      • #18
        After seeing what happened with monorail red this past week, I feel like writing an open letter to WDW management / Disney. Maybe someone from middle management will read this, pass the recommendation along. Who knows? Anyway, it would go something like this:

        To the Walt Disney Company, specifically Walt Disney World management: Thank you for providing one of the premier vacation destinations in the world. We anxiously await the expansion and refurbishments at Disney's Hollywood Studios and Epcot Center, and appreciate the dedication and investment with Pandora, the World of Avatar at Disney's Animal Kingdom, and the installation of the Skyliner gondola system to the resort.

        As a community of some of the most fanatical, rabid, and dedicated Disney Parks fans, we now ask that you turn your attention toward more immediate and pressing needs. Specifically, the situation with the monorails at the Walt Disney World resort. It has become painfully obvious to those of us who frequent the Parks, that the current system is not sustainable. In fact, safety issues are occurring on a more regular basis with these old 1989 trains.

        We realize that with a massive entertainment corporation such as the Walt Disney Company, money is allocated to different areas, divisions, segments, departments, etc., at different times. While it seems easy to the layperson to just go take a few million here and throw it over at a problem there, we know that large business simply does not work that way. As a publicly held company, Disney is expected to show profit on a quarterly basis. Oftentimes, this means raising cost for the guest (with souvenirs, hotel room rates, ticket prices, food), decreasing employee hours and benefits, decreasing the quality of food served in the Parks, cutting back on features and expansion plans, and deferring upgrades and routine maintenance.

        Please fix the WDW monorail fleet... no, please upgrade or replace the monorail train system at WDW resort.

        We know that the Monorail trains are returned nightly to the monorail barn to be inspected, and have routine maintenance performed. But too much is being missed, or too little time allocated for refurbishment and maintenance.
        Find the money, hire extra maintenance staff for the monorail barn, and fix the problem.

        Interior panels, carpet, seats, safety rails, windows, interior paint are the worst I have ever seen in my 45 years of vacationing at the Walt Disney World resort. I know that the monorails are beaten to death every day by guests, some with little concern for the damage they themselves cause.
        Find the money, fix it anyway.

        We know that overall, the WDW monorail system has an excellent safety record when one considers the millions of guests that use it, a few notable and outstanding examples notwithstanding.
        Find the money, fix it anyway. The safety record should be perfect.

        We know that the 50th anniversary of the Walt Disney World resort is just a few years away, and maybe there is something big coming in 3 or 4 years, "if we just hold on a little while longer". We cannot wait till then.
        Find the money, fix it now.

        We also note the Disney has spent millions adapting to an automated monorail system, with monorail pilots who now sit in the cab and let the computerized system take over. The problem is, the monorail cars themselves are literally falling apart.
        Find the money, fix it now.

        With a dozen monorail trains, this would not be a simple, inexpensive, or short process. We, as some of the greatest Disney fans on the planet, understand this. But we need to see movement, we need to see decisions, we need to see something happening. The public face of Walt Disney World management needs to speak to this issue, encourage us, show your passion and dedication for this opening day attraction.

        WDW guests, cast members, monorail pilots and staff, DVC members, Annual Passholders, Florida residents, Disney shareholders, and visitors from outside the USA not only deserve better.... they deserve the best that the WDW Resort / Disney has to offer. You have shown that, when it wants to, WDW can be the best at family entertainment. Our community encourages you as passionately as we know how: please, WDW, be great again.


        All who come to this Happy Place
        Last edited by chris2fett; 01-14-2018, 08:14 AM.


        • #19
          Excellent letter chris2fett, I was very concerned when I saw that incident with monorail red. Please let me know how they respond. Tampa International recently added a completely automated train system that runs pretty far and fast, I believe that the cost/benefit is there for WDW to replace the aging monorails...and it needs to be done sooner than later, personally I feel maintenance used to be held to a much higher standard around the property. This is a MAJOR safety issue.
          The test of success is not what you do when you are on top. Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom.
          -George S. Patton


          • #20
            It's always interesting how quick people are to write off the Monorail as a has-been transportation. The reality is today on our planet there is approximately 250 miles of in-service monorail track and the same amount in a construction/design phase. You might say the hey-day of Monorails is just starting.

            Bombardier is the builder of the current Mark VI Disney World Monorail, they bought the Disney Patents and have gone 2 generations of trains into the future. As it happens by the end of March they will be expanding the Sao Paulo Monorail Line #15 to 7 stations and by June to a total of 10 stations, 28 7 car INNOVIA 300 trains, each train holds 1000 passengers and it's totally automatic plus a escape catwalk between the tracks. There are plans for an expansion to bring the line up to 20 stations, 2 Monorail yards,54 7 car trains total.


            Bombardier is building two Lines of monorail in Thailand and another in Saudi Arabia.
            Hitachi is another major builder and has lines all over Japan
            China has the biggest installation in the world for a single city Chongqing has 32 miles 37 stations

            It beginning to look like Disney is missing out on the dream coming true.

            Disney only needs to order up a replacement set of 12 trains - Bombardier 6 car INNOVIA 200's to get a state of the art monorail. Since the WDW trains are not full size they would not have the capacity of the INNOVIA 300 nor the walk thru design. Imaginearing would conceive the exterior and interior look for the Disney magic touch but under the skin would be proven Mass Transit gear.
            Last edited by Timon; 03-03-2018, 03:12 PM.


            • #21
              Originally posted by Timon View Post

              Disney only needs to order up a replacement set of 12 trains - Bombardier 6 car INNOVIA 200's to get a state of the art monorail. Since the WDW trains are not full size they would not have the capacity of the INNOVIA 300 nor the walk thru design. Imaginearing would conceive the exterior and interior look for the Disney magic touch but under the skin would be proven Mass Transit gear.
              Except the 200's aren't monorails. They're automated trains on a flat track. You can see them at a number of airports (such as DFW). Not something that would work on Disney's monorail beam at all.

              the 300's are actually a true monorail, unlike the 200's. But as you said, they are big for Disney's purpose. But I see it being far easier to scale those down to size to be able to work with Disney's line than trying to modify the 200's. It would be easier to build a whole new train than use the 200's.

              other than that, very true and good insight. :-)


              • #22
                Originally posted by sirwillow View Post

                Except the 200's aren't monorails.
                sirwillow - You are talking about Bombardier's INNOVIA APM 200 an automated people mover often found in airports like DFW, Phoenix and London Heathrow and indeed they are not monorails on a single track but dual beamways either elevated or mounted on the ground.

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                Bombardier's first monorail after buying the Disney Monorail patents was to build the INNOVIA 200 for Las Vegas which today runs over 4 miles on elevated beamways to 7 stations. They are planning a small addition of 1 mile and one station.

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                The INNOVIA 200 has the same bogies and overall dimensions as the Mark VI. Additionally they have been fully automated since grand opening in 2004. I believe the INNOVIA 200 is only built on request, these days. 12 trains would be a small order for Bombardier which builds all types of rail transportation all over the world.

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                Every year Disney World grows more and more congested. The recent changes to Disney Springs has made Light Rail all but impossible to put in at ground level with Buena Vista Dr now 8+ lanes wide. light rail could be elevated but then it would be more expensive than a monorail and darn ugly. The Skyliner might be a good feeder system from limited areas but probably couldn't match the 150,000 capacity per day of the Mark VI.

                A logical choice would be a new line using the INNOVIA 300 to go from Disney Spring westward picking up Typhoon Lagoon, Epcot (XFR to MK line), Yacht & Beach/Swan & Dolphin, DHS(XFR to local SkyLine), Blizzard Beach(XFR to Skyliner), Animal Kingdom and AK Resort. New Skyliner from All Start Resorts to Blizzard Beach and Coronado. New Skyliner from Typhoon Lagoon to Old Key West, Port Orleans, Saratoga, Disney Springs-Marketplace. This would tie most areas together for the EAST-WEST Monorail Line.

                A INNOVIA 300 7 cars = 1000 passengers
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                It's REAL.
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