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  • MJMcB
    started a topic Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Is the pirate as a major Disney franchise gone? The P&P party seems to be failing. At World's End was not the hit Disney hoped. And now Jim Hill is stating that the planned Torutga restaraunt at WDW is a no-go.
    http://www.mouseextra.com/2008/03/03...tuga/#comments

    So the question is: will Disney abandon the pirate thing?

  • MJMcB
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by Rosso11 View Post
    When the day comes that Pirates of the Caribbean is closed forever due to low ridership then I'll change my view, but untill that day Disney is not giving up on Pirates.
    Whats your defintion of giving up Pirates. I don't think they will ever close POTC or stop selling pirate merchandise in the adjacent store.

    But they might stop doing a Jack Sparrow training show, they might stop selling pirate stuff everywhere, they might stop doing a Princess & Pirate party. If thats your definition (and thats what I meant), then they might

    Leave a comment:


  • lazyboy97O
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by Rosso11 View Post
    When the day comes that Pirates of the Caribbean is closed forever due to low ridership then I'll change my view, but untill that day Disney is not giving up on Pirates.
    I think a distinction needs to be made between the attraction and the film based franchise. There are attractions that live beyond their films.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rosso11
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by MJMcB View Post
    They will if we do
    When the day comes that Pirates of the Caribbean is closed forever due to low ridership then I'll change my view, but untill that day Disney is not giving up on Pirates.

    Leave a comment:


  • MJMcB
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by Rosso11 View Post
    So, in short Disney definitly is not giving up on Pirates and I don't think they ever will.
    They will if we do

    Leave a comment:


  • Rosso11
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    The Pirates craze is not dead but its not at its peack either, but thats completly understandable with the trilogy over. As far as little boys are concerened, and some girls, Pirates are timeless and will always be loved by them. They really are the princess equivalent for boys. As far as the P&P parties are concerned they will never be as popular as the traditional Halloween or Christmas parties simply because they are no longer seasonal. The party was created for the off season to make some extra money. Sure you'll get locals to go one time but it wont become an annual event for locals the way the holiday parties are today. So Disney is loosing a lot of the local market which I believe makes up a big percentage of Holiday parties. As far as Tortuga is concerned the breaks were put on the resturant even before the third movie came out, when Pirates was peeking in popularity. Unfortunatly the main reason for this was the price tag that kept increasing. This was suppose to be something really special with animatronic figures throughout the resturant. I'm still holding out that its still going to be made in some form or another. Last I heard it hasn't been cancelled completly just pushed back. So, in short Disney definitly is not giving up on Pirates and I don't think they ever will.

    Leave a comment:


  • lazyboy97O
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    I think GhostHost 2 really nailed the problem with the parties. No other parks stay open later unless they are offering Evening Extra Magic Hours, which are not on Saturday nights.

    Leave a comment:


  • lazyboy97O
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    I think GhostHost 2 really nailed the problem with the parties. No other parks stay open later unless they are offering Evening Extra Magic Hours.

    Leave a comment:


  • GhostHost2
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by WSVR View Post
    I don't consider the special parties a rip off. WDW has 4 theme parks and it only occurs at MK. And it's not like it isn't posted on the schedules that they are closing the park to regular guests at 7. And party guests get to come in at 4 or so. We found the different parade and the different fireworks show to be alone worth the money ourselves. These things cost $$$ to put on. One disappointment we had with things was the rare characters don't come out so much. It's not something we'd do every
    Well traditionally the MK has stayed open the latest of all the parks. AK will be closed once it's time for a party, and DHS will be closed soon after that. EPCOT can stay open to 9:30, but still the MK often traditionally stays open latter than that. Plus, as many problems as I have the MK, at least they have a lot more I enjoy than EPCOT.

    Leave a comment:


  • Jerren
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by Witches of Morva View Post
    ORDDU: From what Jim Hill's article had to say, the REAL reason a pirate theme restaurant might not work at the Magic Kingdom is due to the fact that--according to the article--Disney management believes they can't currently keep the restaurants they already have filled to the brim with guests. As for whether or not the Pirates craze is at an end, it's difficult to say and really depends on who you talk to. It would seem that there will always be an interest in pirates. However, the Disney Marketing people are guilty of doing a pirates 'over-kill', if you ask me.

    ORWEN: I hope they don't still go ahead with that one bad idea they talked about a while back--where all of Adventureland would be turned into a Pirate-land sort of place.
    I find it hard to believe that if they made a new table service restaurant in MK that they would have trouble keeping all the TS restaurants in the kingdom in the black... Anyone who has tried to make PS reservations a month or so out can attest its darned near impossible to get a decent table at a decent hour with the four that are operating now... Even if its not a Pirate themed venue open up the old "Adventureland Veranda" as a table service restaurant already! Then add a Pirates/Indi/Aladin adventurer dinner if they feel they need to fine by me but it would help to revitalize that area right over the hub bridge to adventureland to reopen the veranda, it seems so blah and forgotten since Kikoman pulled its support of the restaurant there.

    Leave a comment:


  • MJMcB
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by Jerren View Post
    Man I love this thread,

    Thanks

    Leave a comment:


  • Jerren
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by kirbilicious View Post
    That's a good point. Many of the P&P parties occur during the "off-season" and that could contribute to the small turnout as well. I wonder if these were offered more during the summer if attendence would increase. Maybe they're trying to use these parties to further diminish the off-season. Doesn't seem to be working too well at the moment.

    Man I love this thread, first off Pirates are not dead, I'm addicted to POTC online now and while as compared to most of the MMOs out there its fairly weak, there is a huge following and fan base. Disney has made a fortune on merch and continues to do so. The movies made money, and they left an opening for a follow up of some sort in the future. Yes it will wane a bit now that the trilogy is over but it still has a core following.

    Now the PPP event was a marketing gimmick pure and simple to try to increase attendance during off peak seasons to fill up empty rooms on property. Where WDW events management went wrong was to try to hard sell the event like they did with the holiday parties. Those parties are around busier peak times where they can get away with the up charge and have a dedicated following. (I have done the MNSSHP about 4-5 times now and we love it and plan a special trip for it, etc.)

    If WDW management was clever what they would have done is offered the party free of charge as a special package for Disney resort guests, similar to the EMH's. This would make the event more exclusive, drive more people to stay on property, and even pull in locals to stay on property for a couple nights if they are die hard fans. (you all know who you are... ) The end result could have been much more profitable for Disney* if they would just take a "add value" approach versus the current RTC model of "hey they're leaving the park with money in thier pockets your not selling enough cheap crap" position they have been taking for the past several years...

    * Do the Disney Math: 40$ a ticket vrs say a 2-3 night minimum stay at a value resort at 151/night + tickets + food and merch. = Poor business planning WDW! Now imagine if they stayed at the Contemporary or Poly!

    Leave a comment:


  • kirbilicious
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by WDWGirl View Post
    I may be wrong, but wasn't P&P done during school time most of the time? I could be wrong! But if this is the case, that could be why many people didn't go. Usually people wait until summer, Spring Break, Christmas - and other major vacation times to go. I LOVE the pirates idea - I've always loved the movies, the ride - just all of it. I would've gone to the P&P myself if it wasn't for some of the scheduled days. Most were weekdays, as opposed to the Halloween event that I faithfully went to for 3 years in a row. I was able to find a few Fridays to choose from, and went from there to coordinate a good time to go. I really hope it stays popular!
    That's a good point. Many of the P&P parties occur during the "off-season" and that could contribute to the small turnout as well. I wonder if these were offered more during the summer if attendence would increase. Maybe they're trying to use these parties to further diminish the off-season. Doesn't seem to be working too well at the moment.

    Leave a comment:


  • nbodyhome
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Originally posted by MJMcB View Post
    I enjoyed the Xmas Party a lot. I wrote a review.
    http://www.mouseextra.com/2007/11/16...money/#respond

    My wife thought it was a waste of cash.

    I love the end where nearly everything is empty. We just kept riding Big Thunder over and over.

    We're trying P&P in May
    I love empty parks! I was with a friend on Presidents Day, and pretty much everything that evening was a walk on - including the Astro Orbitor (no extra money required!) My favorite party is the Mickeys Not So Scary, I could do that every day and not get bored.

    Leave a comment:


  • MJMcB
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    I enjoyed the Xmas Party a lot. I wrote a review.
    http://www.mouseextra.com/2007/11/16...money/#respond

    My wife thought it was a waste of cash.

    I love the end where nearly everything is empty. We just kept riding Big Thunder over and over.

    We're trying P&P in May

    Leave a comment:


  • WSVR
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    I think several things are contributing to Pirate and Princess not getting the attendance.

    1. The other parties center around an existing holiday, Pirate and Princess does not.
    2. Pirate and Princess hasn't had the best of dates to work with.

    I don't consider the special parties a rip off. WDW has 4 theme parks and it only occurs at MK. And it's not like it isn't posted on the schedules that they are closing the park to regular guests at 7. And party guests get to come in at 4 or so. We found the different parade and the different fireworks show to be alone worth the money ourselves. These things cost $$$ to put on. One disappointment we had with things was the rare characters don't come out so much. It's not something we'd do every

    Leave a comment:


  • WDWGirl
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    I may be wrong, but wasn't P&P done during school time most of the time? I could be wrong! But if this is the case, that could be why many people didn't go. Usually people wait until summer, Spring Break, Christmas - and other major vacation times to go. I LOVE the pirates idea - I've always loved the movies, the ride - just all of it. I would've gone to the P&P myself if it wasn't for some of the scheduled days. Most were weekdays, as opposed to the Halloween event that I faithfully went to for 3 years in a row. I was able to find a few Fridays to choose from, and went from there to coordinate a good time to go. I really hope it stays popular!

    Leave a comment:


  • MJMcB
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    If they did make the P&P a little more special, maybe it would do better. Frankly, I hope it continues to play at lower capacity. I'm doing it in May

    Leave a comment:


  • BC_DisneyGeek
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    Very true. People like to make an extra effort (and are willing to take on the extra expense) to celebrate major holidays. I'd be less willing to shell out $40 just because Disney came up with an excuse to part me with my money.

    Leave a comment:


  • flotsam_mike
    replied
    Re: Is the Age of Pirates Gone?

    ^^ Definitely think you have a point there.

    In general I think Disney has a lot of issues cultivating new characters to be long term commodities. Decision making is made for the momement not the long haul.

    Leave a comment:

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