Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

[rv2disneyland]

Hi, I don't know if you can help me to understand . . .

My daughter applied at Disneyland and was so excited to be hired! She recently moved to CA from out of state, she is 20 and still gaining the understanding of the application process. Sometimes she reads things too fast due to her ADD and misses out on understanding the full meaning of a question. I cannot even begin to Emphasize that she would never NEVER never lie on an application. On the application it asks if you have ever been convicted of a felony or crime (or something to that effect) - she answered no, but she had a previous negligent driving and speeding ticket. When she went to her first day of work, they walked her to management and stated they would need her name tag and that she could not come on the Disney property until they could review her reasons for lying on the application. When confronted, she honestly replied that she thought the negligent driving in her state was considered more a ticket than a felony. In truth it is considered a misdemeanor, but she thought Disney was asking if she had ever been in jail or commited a felony, she answered with what she believed to be true on the application. I know that alot of people come and go intentionally trying to hide their history and lie, but I cannot stress here that - call it naive, or whatever she was not attempting to lie or cover up anything. When she called me in tears and her heart broken, I explained that I would have probably written the same thing because there was a time when employers were only seeking heavy duty criminal activity. She was 16 when she got the negligent driving and it was wrong, but she has got to be one of the most sweetest loving responsible kids; it has been 4 years and a speeding ticket later and I guess Disneyland wanted a list of every offense committed, large or small. To wrap this up, she was told she would be called in to be interviewed within a few days or the following friday. 3 weeks later she was called in not to be given a chance to explain or follow up on all of her positive references, but to tell her that she can NEVER apply to anything Disney again. In hindsight I told her that she should have asked personnel at the time to what extent she needed to list her incidents, but she didn't realize she was doing anything wrong and therefore processed the information as she did. My big question, is this true - She can "never ever apply at anything Disney again"? Thanks for any help in understanding, I know this is the cold hard world we live in and Disney has their standards, but if they could have given her a chance to prove herself, they would have seen that she would truly have been an asset. She works very hard and smiles all the time. Sincerely, rv2disneyland

[Lighthope]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

I have not seen a Disney application in a long time, so I don't know what exactly the criminal history question is.

Generally speaking, applications ask for misdemeanours or felonies (except for minor traffic violations). Simply asking if someone has been convicted of a crime is too general.

This is how the question is phrased on the Walt Disney World NAF employment application:

Have you ever been convicted of any offense against the law or forfeited collateral or are you now under charges for any offense against the law as a civilian, or during military service? (You may omit: (1) Traffic Violations for which you paid a fine, and (2) Any offense committed before your 21st birthday which was finally adjudicated in a juvenile court or under a Youth Offender Law.)

By your own admission what she did was a misdemeanour.

she thought Disney was asking if she had ever been in jail or commited a felony

I have to admit that I have some doubts about that. I think more that she was trying to minimise her history, thinking that maybe Disney wouldn't find out about it.

The only saving grace is that her misdemeanour should actually be sealed. Anything you do under 18 doesn't count against you, unless you're the hard core criminal. So there are two possibilities: 1) Her record wasn't sealed. (Likely) 2) She's done something else that you don't know about. (Who knows?)

Bottom line is she lied on the application. And she knew it. She was trying to hide it from Disney, thinking they'd bounce her for her bad driving. (Negligent driving and then gets another speeding ticket? Seems she didn't learn her lesson.)

to tell her that she can NEVER apply to anything Disney again.

Really? Gee, that seems unusually punitive. There either has to be something more to that negligent driving charge or there's something else on her record you don't know about. Mind you, I don't exactly know what "negligent driving" means, so I'm only guessing.

Here's what I would do:

Disney (desperate as they are) hold job fairs all the time. Those are times when you fill out an application, get interviewed, and hired all at the same time. Have her go to one, fill out the application (honestly this time!), and get an interview. And at the interview, fess up about what happened last time she applied. Don't do it right off the bat. Let them see her and talk to her first, learn what a "sweetest loving responsible kid" she is. Tell her to bring all her letters of recommendation. Give them to the interviewer. Then mention the previous application. Let her tell her story that she misunderstood the question and that she thought her violation was only an infraction and not a misdemeanour. If she can impress the interviewer enough, he might go to bat for her.

That's the best advice I can give on what seems to me to be a bit of a suspicious story. But then, I'm a bit paranoid and see monsters all over the place. So what do I know? It wouldn't be the first time I've misjudged a situation.

Lighthope

Pearls of Wisdom - The most dangerous threat to the environment is an environmentalist.

--== TIGERS' QUEST - www.tigersquest.com
--== THE DOCTOR WHO AUDIO DRAMAS - www.dwad.net

[JeffYardDog]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

I have not seen a Disney application in a long time, so I don't know what exactly the criminal history question is.

Generally speaking, applications ask for misdemeanours or felonies (except for minor traffic violations). Simply asking if someone has been convicted of a crime is too general.

This is how the question is phrased on the Walt Disney World NAF employment application:



By your own admission what she did was a misdemeanour.



I have to admit that I have some doubts about that. I think more that she was trying to minimise her history, thinking that maybe Disney wouldn't find out about it.

The only saving grace is that her misdemeanour should actually be sealed. Anything you do under 18 doesn't count against you, unless you're the hard core criminal. So there are two possibilities: 1) Her record wasn't sealed. (Likely) 2) She's done something else that you don't know about. (Who knows?)

Bottom line is she lied on the application. And she knew it. She was trying to hide it from Disney, thinking they'd bounce her for her bad driving. (Negligent driving and then gets another speeding ticket? Seems she didn't learn her lesson.)



Really? Gee, that seems unusually punitive. There either has to be something more to that negligent driving charge or there's something else on her record you don't know about. Mind you, I don't exactly know what "negligent driving" means, so I'm only guessing.

Here's what I would do:

Disney (desperate as they are) hold job fairs all the time. Those are times when you fill out an application, get interviewed, and hired all at the same time. Have her go to one, fill out the application (honestly this time!), and get an interview. And at the interview, fess up about what happened last time she applied. Don't do it right off the bat. Let them see her and talk to her first, learn what a "sweetest loving responsible kid" she is. Tell her to bring all her letters of recommendation. Give them to the interviewer. Then mention the previous application. Let her tell her story that she misunderstood the question and that she thought her violation was only an infraction and not a misdemeanour. If she can impress the interviewer enough, he might go to bat for her.

That's the best advice I can give on what seems to me to be a bit of a suspicious story. But then, I'm a bit paranoid and see monsters all over the place. So what do I know? It wouldn't be the first time I've misjudged a situation.

Lighthope

I agree with you: What do you know ?

Without even knowing the girl you accuse her of purposely lying and having evil intentions. How about sticking to the facts as presented and giving responsible advice within that context ?

You do have one valid issue to bring up though. Juvenile records should be sealed. How that relates precisely to a hiring situation remains to be seen. Whether the law applies to those who control the records, who reported them (the background check company, presumably), or Disney itself who used them probably requires some specific knowledge of the law and legal advice - not amateur lawyers in Micechat.

Your other advice seems even worse. She will have to tell them she had previously applied or it will be revealed when they check her SSN when she applies. She likely won't even get as far as an interview. Her records would indicate that she had failed screening and she would be stopped at that point.

This issue should be addressed now unless there is no intention to ever apply with Disney again and to determine how those records were revealed and what immunity those minor records should have had.

I suggest that they contact Disney casting and insist on talking to a manager. Don't get put off by one of the screening-bots. Ask to make an appointment to discuss the situation. It is almost sure they will not discuss something like this over the phone. Also, they owe you a copy of the report from which any information was obtained. This might show up in other hiring situations.

But before embarking on this, the OP should determine how far and hard they want to push on this matter. It's unclear if Disney would consider backing down without a lot of pressure, if at all.

IMO, which isn't worth much, the girl shouldn't be penalized for failing to understand the nature of a legal proceeding when she was 16 years old even if the parent did. She was forced to make a choice then and there while filling out the application.

[cerpin taxt]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

Um, I don't know much about the law Lightrope, but wouldn't this fall under Traffic violations for which you paid a fine, especially since she did not have to go to jail? I know I would have at least thought that, even if it is technically a misdemeaner. Seriously, that wouldn't have thrown you off a little? I know very few people with a squeeky clean driving record, so I would have assumed the same thing. I do not think that she thought she was lying or trying to hide anything if this story is complete, which I have no reason to doubt. I have limited knowlege of the technicalities of the law and of Disney's hiring procedures, so I can't say much about this except that it sounds very unreasonable. I would have demanded to know more though, at least for future reference.

[Lighthope]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

I agree with you: What do you know ?

Possibly a little bit more about how things are done with regard to employment screening than you think I do.

Without even knowing the girl you accuse her of purposely lying and having evil intentions. How about sticking to the facts as presented and giving responsible advice within that context ?

I know what a criminal background check looks like. I've run a number of them. I know that she had a misdemeanour on her record and she said she didn't. Last I checked, that kind of was the definition of lying. But things in California are a bit different than the real world, so maybe I'm wrong on that.

Your other advice seems even worse. She will have to tell them she had previously applied or it will be revealed when they check her SSN when she applies. She likely won't even get as far as an interview. Her records would indicate that she had failed screening and she would be stopped at that point.

Do you even know how they conduct a Job Fair at Disney? They don't look any of that stuff up until after you get hired. You fill out the application and go straight to an interview. In fact, I think I said that. "Those are times when you fill out an application, get interviewed, and hired all at the same time." Yup. There it is.

Please, please don't talk about stuff you don't know about. It just causes confusion for people who are trying to get honest answers and advice.

I suggest that they contact Disney casting and insist on talking to a manager.

I'm sure they love it when parents call up to talk about their children. She's an adult. She can fight her own battles.

the girl shouldn't be penalized for failing to understand the nature of a legal proceeding when she was 16 years old even if the parent did.

For a misdemeanour, she must have had a Court proceeding where she either plead guilty or was found guilty. I would not dare accuse someone of being so ignorant as to not understand the gravity of that.

Lighthope

Pearls of Wisdom - "If we accept that a mother can kill her own child, how can we tell people not to kill each other?" - Mother Teresa on abortion

--== TIGERS' QUEST - www.tigersquest.com
--== THE DOCTOR WHO AUDIO DRAMAS - www.dwad.net

[rv2disneyland]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

Thank you so much for your responses. I will advise her to get in touch with the lawyer that we worked with at the time and ask what we have to do to follow up on the negligent to see if it will be sealed when she turns 21. She never did go to jail, that is why she probably thought of it more like a ticket - it was handled by the attorney. I feel the most responsible for this, because I didn't emphasize to her that it was a misdemeanor. I feel really bad. She is a trusting person, I feel I let her down by not preparing her for this. Her attorney at the time told her that her reprecussions would be 1) increased insurance payments for a period of time and that 2) if she were seeking law enforcement positions or driving positions then she might be out of luck. I appreciate your honest words and follow up to this. Thank you.

[Lighthope]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

Um, I don't know much about the law Lightrope, but wouldn't this fall under Traffic violations for which you paid a fine, especially since she did not have to go to jail?

No. Those are called infractions. They are civil crimes, as opposed to "crime" crimes where you can actually go to jail.

I do not think that she thought she was lying or trying to hide anything if this story is complete, which I have no reason to doubt.

The blip on my radar is that a misdemeanour at 16 is showing up on her record. It shouldn't. At least, I don't think it should. There are different kinds of records, some public and some private. If you go to traffic school to have a ticket taken care of, it doesn't show on your public record but it still shows up on your private one. The record that Disney accesses really shouldn't be showing it. Or maybe they are accessing a record that I don't have experience with.

I used to have a friend who worked in Casting... Be interesting to see what they are able to look up nowadays.

Lighthope

Pearls of Wisdom - I got everything but the part after "Now listen closely..."

--== TIGERS' QUEST - www.tigersquest.com
--== THE DOCTOR WHO AUDIO DRAMAS - www.dwad.net

[Lighthope]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

Her attorney at the time told her that her reprecussions would be 1) increased insurance payments for a period of time and that 2) if she were seeking law enforcement positions or driving positions then she might be out of luck. I appreciate your honest words and follow up to this. Thank you.

Out of luck for law enforcement? Permanently?!

Look, we don't know you from boo, so is there any chance you can tell us exactly what it is she did? I've never heard of a misdemeanour permanently barring someone even from law enforcement. Felonies, yes. But not misdemeanours.

It might help us to understand if we knew what it was that Disney seems to have found out.

Lighthope

Pearls of Wisdom - "There is a fundamental difference between intelligence and wisdom. Learn the meaning of one and you'll gain the other." - Lord Steven

--== TIGERS' QUEST - www.tigersquest.com
--== THE DOCTOR WHO AUDIO DRAMAS - www.dwad.net

[rv2disneyland]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

DUI reduced to a Negligent driving. I do believe it stays on the record for 7 years as a Negligent unless she were to ever have another DUI, then we were told it would go back to DUI.

[Alpine]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

So wouldn't that be a DUI at 16? That kind of implies quite a bit more than a traffic ticket...

[Duffy]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

Um, I don't know much about the law Lightrope, but wouldn't this fall under Traffic violations for which you paid a fine, especially since she did not have to go to jail? I know I would have at least thought that, even if it is technically a misdemeaner. Seriously, that wouldn't have thrown you off a little? I know very few people with a squeeky clean driving record, so I would have assumed the same thing. I do not think that she thought she was lying or trying to hide anything if this story is complete, which I have no reason to doubt. I have limited knowlege of the technicalities of the law and of Disney's hiring procedures, so I can't say much about this except that it sounds very unreasonable. I would have demanded to know more though, at least for future reference.

agreed... I remember saying i was never convicted of any crime and jail. BUT i have recieved 3 fix it tickets and 1 traffic violation. They didnt say anything about it... despite the fact that i was told my 3 fix it tickets would know show, it still showed... BUT i did cover my butt and go to traffic school to get rid of that point for my traffic violation.

I would go and talk to a manager... Most of the time, they are more understandable...

If not, be like me when i got rejected the first time, go work for Knotts Berry Farm... their interviews are more realistic...

Another is, whatever you choose on the list, you wont get it... i applied for Disney's Vacation Club, but was told going into ODV... my choices were ODV or Custodial...

I hope everything works out ofr your Daughter! You should tell her crap happens but she will rebound and find a better job!

[rv2disneyland]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

It was reduced to a negligent and unless she gets another DUI, it will be erased from her record after 7 years. I know, probably makes her sound like a really bad person.
No other problems since that time, except trying to make it to class on time and not watching the speed.

[rv2disneyland]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

She's doing ok now, working on a set for VH1 and actually handling things much better than I.
Guess the "you can never apply at anything Disney again" was very hard to hear. It was one of her dreams, but then life can occur. . . We live we learn. Thanks again for all your input. Sincerely, RV2disneyland

[JeffYardDog]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

Possibly a little bit more about how things are done with regard to employment screening than you think I do.

I know what a criminal background check looks like. I've run a number of them. I know that she had a misdemeanour on her record and she said she didn't. Last I checked, that kind of was the definition of lying. But things in California are a bit different than the real world, so maybe I'm wrong on that.



Do you even know how they conduct a Job Fair at Disney? They don't look any of that stuff up until after you get hired. You fill out the application and go straight to an interview. In fact, I think I said that. "Those are times when you fill out an application, get interviewed, and hired all at the same time." Yup. There it is.

Please, please don't talk about stuff you don't know about. It just causes confusion for people who are trying to get honest answers and advice.



I'm sure they love it when parents call up to talk about their children. She's an adult. She can fight her own battles.

For a misdemeanour, she must have had a Court proceeding where she either plead guilty or was found guilty. I would not dare accuse someone of being so ignorant as to not understand the gravity of that.

Lighthope

There you go again supposing things that you have no knowledge of and inventing things to support your Point of View.

Then consider your accusation that she was lying. The definition of a Lie is:

1. A false statement deliberately presented as being true; a falsehood.
2. Something meant to deceive or give a wrong impression.

If she stated something that was not true, it's a falsity but if she did not intend to deceive but misunderstood either the legal ramifications of her history or what Disney was asking, it's not intentional and it's not a lie.


Not only do I know how they conduct the Job Fairs, I was a CM at the Resort fairly recently and went through the whole process.

The issue wasn't that 'that stuff' would be checked right away if she went to a Job Fair, it was that - if she went to a Job Fair - she would be asked upfront if she ever had worked for or applied at Disney before and they would check their records and find out the situation without ever having her go through an interview. There THAT is. Yup.

I did not accuse anyone of anything. You were the one throwing around accusations. And the advice was given to the OP because she stated that her daughter had ADD. That suggests that there are some situations she might not handle on her own; like the one that happened already.

[youcancallmechris]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

*sigh*

She recently moved to CA from out of state, she is 20 and still gaining the understanding of the application process. Sometimes she reads things too fast due to her ADD and misses out on understanding the full meaning of a question.

I cannot even begin to Emphasize that she would never NEVER never lie on an application.

On the application it asks if you have ever been convicted of a felony or crime (or something to that effect) - she answered no, but she had a previous negligent driving and speeding ticket. When she went to her first day of work, they walked her to management and stated they would need her name tag and that she could not come on the Disney property until they could review her reasons for lying on the application. When confronted, she honestly replied that she thought the negligent driving in her state was considered more a ticket than a felony. In truth it is considered a misdemeanor, but she thought Disney was asking if she had ever been in jail or committed a felony, she answered with what she believed to be true on the application. I know that alot of people come and go intentionally trying to hide their history and lie, but I cannot stress here that - call it naive, or whatever she was not attempting to lie or cover up anything.

September 11, 2001. Sorry- you got to read the fine print. As far as I recall the general process would be, she was taken to a private area with an interviewer and her Manager(s), and then talked to.

When she called me in tears and her heart broken, I explained that I would have probably written the same thing because there was a time when employers were only seeking heavy duty criminal activity.

She was 16 when she got the negligent driving and it was wrong, but she has got to be one of the most sweetest loving responsible kids; it has been 4 years and a speeding ticket later and I guess Disneyland wanted a list of every offense committed, large or small.

To wrap this up, she was told she would be called in to be interviewed within a few days or the following friday. 3 weeks later she was called in not to be given a chance to explain or follow up on all of her positive references, but to tell her that she can NEVER apply to anything Disney again.

In hindsight I told her that she should have asked personnel at the time to what extent she needed to list her incidents, but she didn't realize she was doing anything wrong and therefore processed the information as she did. My big question, is this true - She can "never ever apply at anything Disney again"? Thanks for any help in understanding, I know this is the cold hard world we live in and Disney has their standards, but if they could have given her a chance to prove herself, they would have seen that she would truly have been an asset. She works very hard and smiles all the time. Sincerely, rv2disneyland

All my insight or feedback might vary slightly as I worked only in a few lines of business but for the most part, their policies and procedures were pretty consistent. Please also note that she had to have signed a background check waiver and she should have received a copy in the mail. Good luck! Oh yeah...Get it Expunged?

[youcancallmechris]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

and I just now realized things had 'worked themsevles out' but I typed all that crud above and am not putting it to waste!

[youcancallmechris]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

DUI reduced to a Negligent driving. I do believe it stays on the record for 7 years as a Negligent unless she were to ever have another DUI, then we were told it would go back to DUI.

huh, I thought you could smash your deal with ANY OTHER act of 'negligent driving'

[Lighthope]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

If she stated something that was not true, it's a falsity

Let me guess, you have trouble with what the definition of "is" is as well, right?

Not only do I know how they conduct the Job Fairs, I was a CM at the Resort fairly recently and went through the whole process.

Based on what you say about how Job Fairs are conducted, I actually have my doubts that you went through one. I'm starting to wonder if you have even been to Disneyland itself.

if she went to a Job Fair - she would be asked upfront if she ever had worked for or applied at Disney before and they would check their records

No, she wouldn't be asked (except on the application) and no they wouldn't check the records right there. Job Fairs are very fast endeavours with no record look-up until after the fact.

Since you are making stuff up, there is no further point in carrying any kind of conversation with you. The OP can decide to take your (obviously ill-knowledge) advice or not. His choice.

Lighthope

Pearls of Wisdom - "A girl phoned me the other day and said 'Come on over, there's nobody home.' I went over. Nobody was home." - Rodney Dangerfield

--== TIGERS' QUEST - www.tigersquest.com
--== THE DOCTOR WHO AUDIO DRAMAS - www.dwad.net

[lazyboy97O]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

Hi, I don't know if you can help me to understand . . .

My daughter applied at Disneyland and was so excited to be hired! She recently moved to CA from out of state

This might actually be part of the issue. What state did she move from? I know that here in Georgia there is no legal distinction for traffic violations, they are all misdemeanors. All accused traffic violators, unless you pay the fine early, are arraigned and not seperate from those accused of other crimes.

[cerpin taxt]

Re: Daughter fired after 2 days - Application process?

Let me guess, you have trouble with what the definition of "is" is as well, right?

Clever little retort, but jeffyardog is right. It's only a lie if you're actually intending to deceive. Look both words up in the dictionary. Oh wait I forgot, you don't need to because you obviously know everything. Don't you think those would be pretty high standards to consider a person honest only if they make 100% true statements 100% of the time? Humans are not capable of having completely accurate and flawless knowlege of everything. Except for you of course.

Based on what you say about how Job Fairs are conducted, I actually have my doubts that you went through one. I'm starting to wonder if you have even been to Disneyland itself.

Hmm. There you go making assumptions again about people you don't know. Must be true if it came from you.