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  • #21
    Re: Absurd Lockers

    Of course it's another way for the park to make $$, otherwise they would be FREE.

    But it's ALSO a way to improve ride-wait times and safety. So it's a win-win for everybody. The load times for the rides are MUCH faster than they were prior to the lockers. I don't think anybody could argue with that.

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    • #22
      Re: Absurd Lockers

      I am in the category of "if you don't like them then don't use them"...I have a pair of shorts (which are wearing out) with nice sealing pockets for my Six Flags trips. It is pretty simple (though I've seen it plenty and understand why the generation of "no rules" can't grasp this). "What do you mean I can't just throw my stuff wherever I want to in the station and expect it to be there when I get back?"

      However, there is something to be said regarding the difference in experience and perception of a park that offers them for a $1 each no matter what (Six Flags) and a park that offers them for free for up to 30 min past the current posted wait time (Universal).

      It is one of those things where while they make profit for both parks, I don't quite feel as used by Universal. Universal is taking less profit to make my day better (or make me feel like my day is better). I use their lockers because of this, even when I can fit everything into my pockets.

      ^ If the lockers were in place to make money, they'd cost more than $1 and wouldn't be run by SmarteCart.
      I would counter that and say if they were not in place to make money they would be free. Nothing outside of rides are run at-cost or for a loss simply as a convenience. Especially at Six Flags.

      Edit: /\ Beat me to it.
      Last edited by tloolgb; 02-08-2010, 03:14 PM.

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      • #23
        Re: Absurd Lockers

        The lockers shouldn't be free. They cost money to install and maintain. But yes, I agree Universal's policy is easier to swallow.

        I'd rather put up with mandatory paid lockers than longer waits in line. You're paying either way. Setting stuff off to the side absolutely slows things down, reducing capacity. That means your opportunity cost per ride goes up.

        Like tloolgb, we travel light. Everything we carry fits into sealed pockets or travel wallet style waist belts. My wife grumbled about leaving her purse behind at first. Now she likes the freedom from fuss.

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        • #24
          Re: Absurd Lockers

          Originally posted by hauntedtrail13 View Post
          When you go with someone that has a purse or anything like that is it a pain in the butt to have to pay for a locker at all for something like that.
          A more effective solution to that problem isn't complaining, but leaving the purse behind as I suggested. I'm obviously not crazy in suggesting this.

          Originally posted by PAL
          Like tloolgb, we travel light. Everything we carry fits into sealed pockets or travel wallet style waist belts. My wife grumbled about leaving her purse behind at first. Now she likes the freedom from fuss.
          Now, if that's not for you, it's not for you, but it's still your choice as to what sort of personal luggage you bring into any park.

          Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
          You say its not a way to make money are you kidding me??? Why would they put them there to begin with if that wasn't the case.
          Originally posted by sir clinksalot View Post
          Of course it's another way for the park to make $$, otherwise they would be FREE
          You do realize that there are costs involved in running those lockers, right? Those costs are made up somehow. Universal chooses to make up for them by overcharging you for other things instead, and likely makes far more extra profit doing that than charging for the locker usage.

          I'm not saying one system of recovering costs is better than another but to criticise SF for excessive profiteering while pointing Universal out as a better way when Universal is actually sucking more of your money out of you than SF is, this is a logic that escapes me.

          Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
          Other parks use the cubby hole system and that works fine. Set you article in the little box on the side of the station and pick it back up when you get off the ride. Then that saves you a dollar every ride. And Im sorry but it wouldn't hurt to be patient to wait an extra minute or two for someone to put their things aside.
          Math time. Each person = 1 extra minute. That's a few extra minutes every train. On a major summer day, those extra minutes per train add up to a rather significant amount of time during which I'm pretty sure you'd rather be riding rides or doing something other than being stuck in line.

          Originally posted by sirclinksalot
          But it's ALSO a way to improve ride-wait times and safety. So it's a win-win for everybody. The load times for the rides are MUCH faster than they were prior to the lockers. I don't think anybody could argue with that.
          Exactly. Seems like the best way, to me, to go if you don't want to pay the $1 locker fee is to just not bring stuff that'd require a locker.

          Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
          The locker on every ride is the biggest money maker their is. I don't care if jo shmoe runs the company for the locker, its still a joke. Hands down.

          I go to the park all the time and don't need a locker. But when my friends do I agree with them that its totally a waste of money.
          The bolded sentence made me LOL. I mean, really?

          Sounds to me like you should be helping your friends to save money by doing what you're doing in order to not NEED a locker for their loose articles.

          Originally posted by PAL View Post
          The lockers shouldn't be free. They cost money to install and maintain. But yes, I agree Universal's policy is easier to swallow.
          Which again is funny to me given what Universal charges for everything else. I guess it's really a perception issue at its center.

          "Who among you is wise and understanding? Let him show by his good behavior his deeds in the gentleness of wisdom." -- James 3:13

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          • #25
            Re: Absurd Lockers

            Sorry but the locker company doesn't keep 100% of the profit. Why would six flags even let a third party come in and do that. They both take a % off of the locker system. Simple as that.
            And as far as saying Universal charges for everything else is kinda stupid. Six flags is just as bad, every theme park for that matter.
            You may disagree with the fact that its not a big money maker but "do the math" thousands of people go on those rides, and hundreds are paying for the lockers. OOOOKKKK I guess its not a money maker. Yeah right. What a joke.

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            • #26
              Re: Absurd Lockers

              Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
              You may disagree with the fact that its not a big money maker but "do the math" thousands of people go on those rides, and hundreds are paying for the lockers. OOOOKKKK I guess its not a money maker. Yeah right. What a joke.
              I think you're a bit confused when it comes to how business in general works.

              Thousands of people buy McDonald's' $1 cheeseburgers, but that doesn't mean they are "the biggest money maker there is" (your words). In reality, McD's is actually losing money by holding the price that low. Even just one park alone has thousands of employees, many rides/attractions/shops/restaurants, and other departments that no guest ever sees. There's no possible way that anything being sold for $1 is anything more than a small blip on the financial radar screen, no matter how many of them are sold.

              Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
              Why would six flags even let a third party come in and do that. They both take a % off of the locker system. Simple as that.
              Again, do you really know what you're talking about here? Have you seen SF's books? Do you work in the park's accounting department? There are some people on this forum who do work in the industry, do know what they're talking about, and know what the real picture is. Let me just say this, if SF/Smart Carte really wanted to make money off the lockers, they wouldn't cost $1.

              And, again, for the umpteenth time, the park isn't forcing anyone to bring loose articles that'd need a locker into the park! I could understand complaints about if there wasn't a choice but to pay for the locker, but we've repeatedly stated the alternatives, and the benefits of the locker policy. Why are we arguing about this again?

              And, honestly, would anyone be happier if the locker policy was revoked and wait times went back to where they were? Really?
              Last edited by PeoplemoverMatt; 02-12-2010, 02:44 AM.

              "Who among you is wise and understanding? Let him show by his good behavior his deeds in the gentleness of wisdom." -- James 3:13

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              • #27
                Re: Absurd Lockers

                Originally posted by PeoplemoverMatt View Post
                I think you're a bit confused when it comes to how business in general works.

                Thousands of people buy McDonald's' $1 cheeseburgers, but that doesn't mean they are "the biggest money maker there is" (your words). In reality, McD's is actually losing money by holding the price that low. Even just one park alone has thousands of employees, many rides/attractions/shops/restaurants, and other departments that no guest ever sees. There's no possible way that anything being sold for $1 is anything more than a small blip on the financial radar screen, no matter how many of them are sold.



                Again, do you really know what you're talking about here? Have you seen SF's books? Do you work in the park's accounting department? There are some people on this forum who do work in the industry, do know what they're talking about, and know what the real picture is. Let me just say this, if SF/Smart Carte really wanted to make money off the lockers, they wouldn't cost $1.

                And, again, for the umpteenth time, the park isn't forcing anyone to bring loose articles that'd need a locker into the park! I could understand complaints about if there wasn't a choice but to pay for the locker, but we've repeatedly stated the alternatives, and the benefits of the locker policy. Why are we arguing about this again?

                And, honestly, would anyone be happier if the locker policy was revoked and wait times went back to where they were? Really?
                Yes sir/miss, I do believe I know what I'm talking about. I am involved with a multi-million dollar bussiness, and while I'm not really running the show, I'm very close with the 'big heads' who are. I'm not naive to the ways of the world, and honestly, I find your assumption that I don't know what I'm talking about to be a bit insulting.

                The lockers are a sneak profit. Sure, they may not be as much of a 'cash sucker' as the initial ticket price, but just consider how many people go through the waiting areas for each roller coaster at Six Flags everyday. They're taking a dollar from each person with loose articles... unless of course they have a non-riding member of their party, but that is a small minority usually. Six Flags gets a percentage of the dollar as well as the locker company.

                Now, are you saying that you yourself have looked at Six Flag's books and know exactly what the deal is between them and the company you speak of? Isn't that an unfair means of argument when, I'm going to assume, you have no idea how the financial workings of Six Flags operates?

                By the way, the one dollar cheeseburger example doesn't work. If McDonald's was in fact 'losing money' by selling their cheeseburgers at one dollar, why the heck wouldn't they just pull the product? The entire point is that they're making a product that is cheap so that everyone will be able to afford it. When you take one dollar from each person who wants a cheeseburger, it adds up to be a huge money maker.

                Okay, final point. Who doesn't bring loose articles into the park? Of course Six Flags isn't forcing anyone to bring loose articles in, it's the PEOPLE who bring them in. Six Flags probably doesn't give two turds about whether you bring your antique camera into the park or not, but some people 'want' to take pictures. So now, they've found a way to exploit those poor people. More power to them and the locker company.

                If Six Flags really cared about their guests and cutting down on wait times, wouldn't they just make the lockers free? Hmmmmm? Oh! And it costs fifteen bucks to park in the parking lot. They should just make that free too. Because Six Flags cares.

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                • #28
                  Re: Absurd Lockers

                  Well, in the cheeseburger example, people buy drinks and fries to go along with the burger, and that's where the profit margin shows up
                  See more of my horrible photos (and a few good ones) at my Flickr photostream

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                  • #29
                    Re: Absurd Lockers

                    When I go to Six Flags, I generally:

                    Leave everything in the car. Then, before lunch I grab my Camera from the car. After lunch, I snap some photos (no riding coasters right after eating! - this is a great time to just stroll around the park and hit some of the smaller coasters), then I go put it back in the car. Yes, it's a bit of a hassle, but I know my stuff is safe and wont drop.
                    -Monorail Man

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                    • #30
                      Re: Absurd Lockers

                      Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
                      I'm not naive to the ways of the world, and honestly, I find your assumption that I don't know what I'm talking about to be a bit insulting.
                      At the risk of sounding insulting, you're getting a lot wrong, which leads me to believe that you really don't know a lot about what you're talking about.

                      Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
                      The lockers are a sneak profit. Sure, they may not be as much of a 'cash sucker' as the initial ticket price, but just consider how many people go through the waiting areas for each roller coaster at Six Flags everyday.
                      Yeah I'd say they aren't as much of a "cash sucker" as the admission price. Admission is $29.99 online, and over $50 per person at the gate. It's $1 to fit as many loose articles from your entire party that you can. There's a LARGE difference.

                      Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
                      Isn't that an unfair means of argument when, I'm going to assume, you have no idea how the financial workings of Six Flags operates?
                      That would be an incorrect assumption. Please refer back to what I said above about how there are some people on this forum who do work in the industry, do know what they're talking about, and do know what the real picture is.

                      Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
                      By the way, the one dollar cheeseburger example doesn't work. If McDonald's was in fact 'losing money' by selling their cheeseburgers at one dollar, why the heck wouldn't they just pull the product?
                      1) It sells.

                      2) It brings guests into their restaurants, which means they aren't in a competitor's restaurant.

                      3) The $1 cheeseburger usually sells fries, sodas, and other various accompaniments along with it which easily makes up the small loss per cheeseburger McD's incurs.

                      4) After enough $1 cheeseburgers, a guest will usually want to explore the rest of the menu. This means additional sales for McD's and not for their competitors.

                      It's basic business. Do whatever you can to gain marketshare. The point is that a small loss on that sale can yield numerous other benefits in other ways. In some cases, just making people happier is the best effect any business can have. It means they'll want to come back to you. The lockers help decrease wait times which makes people happier than they would be without the no loose articles policy. Happier guests is good for business, as well as the guests.

                      Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
                      Six Flags probably doesn't give two turds about whether you bring your antique camera into the park or not, but some people 'want' to take pictures. So now, they've found a way to exploit those poor people. More power to them and the locker company.
                      How exactly is requiring loose articles be secured, either in a $1 locker, or some other means "exploiting" people who want to take pictures? If SF held a gun to each guest's head and forced their stuff into a paid locker, you may have a point, but guests are free to put their cameras in a zippered pocket, or with a non-riding member of their party, or a $1 temp use locker, or an all-day locker, or their car, or some other means.

                      Honestly, the whole point of the $1 locker is to ensure that NO loose articles are brought to the loading area delaying the load/unload time of each train, thereby decreasing queue wait times. It's a very effective policy, and you also won't loose that antique camera forever should it fall away from you during your ride.

                      Originally posted by hauntedtrail13
                      If Six Flags really cared about their guests and cutting down on wait times, wouldn't they just make the lockers free? Hmmmmm?
                      Again, this is really basic business. Installing/operating/maintaining those lockers takes money. That money doesn't just appear out of nowhere. Universal overcharges its guests in numerous other ways, and is a completely different financial animal than a SF park is. Trying to compare a theme park to a movie studio/theme park/entertainment district is comparing apples to potato salad.

                      Originally posted by Monorail Man
                      After lunch, I snap some photos (no riding coasters right after eating! - this is a great time to just stroll around the park and hit some of the smaller coasters), then I go put it back in the car. Yes, it's a bit of a hassle, but I know my stuff is safe and wont drop.
                      And that's totally your choice, and totally cool. In fact, you could even drive your camera off SF property to your residence or hotel if you wanted to thanks to the free in n' out of the guest parking lot that every paid vehicle has.

                      The lockers are a simple matter of convenience, just like pretty much everything else in the park. Want candy in the park? It costs money. Want food in the park? It costs money. Want to have your loose articles unsecured as you walk around? Great, but you'll need to secure them somehow before you board a ride, and there are lockers provided. Believe it or not, they cost money. The lockers help decrease wait times for everyone, which add value to the overall park product, just like having gift shops & restaurants in the park do. This isn't a matter of exploitation. I believe it's called "running a business."
                      Last edited by PeoplemoverMatt; 02-21-2010, 03:30 AM.

                      "Who among you is wise and understanding? Let him show by his good behavior his deeds in the gentleness of wisdom." -- James 3:13

                      Comment


                      • #31
                        Re: Absurd Lockers

                        Originally posted by hauntedtrail13 View Post

                        Okay, final point. Who doesn't bring loose articles into the park?
                        I don't.

                        Comment


                        • #32
                          Re: Absurd Lockers

                          Originally posted by PeoplemoverMatt View Post
                          At the risk of sounding insulting, you're getting a lot wrong, which leads me to believe that you really don't know a lot about what you're talking about.



                          Yeah I'd say they aren't as much of a "cash sucker" as the admission price. Admission is $29.99 online, and over $50 per person at the gate. It's $1 to fit as many loose articles from your entire party that you can. There's a LARGE difference.



                          That would be an incorrect assumption. Please refer back to what I said above about how there are some people on this forum who do work in the industry, do know what they're talking about, and do know what the real picture is.



                          1) It sells.

                          2) It brings guests into their restaurants, which means they aren't in a competitor's restaurant.

                          3) The $1 cheeseburger usually sells fries, sodas, and other various accompaniments along with it which easily makes up the small loss per cheeseburger McD's incurs.

                          4) After enough $1 cheeseburgers, a guest will usually want to explore the rest of the menu. This means additional sales for McD's and not for their competitors.

                          It's basic business. Do whatever you can to gain marketshare. The point is that a small loss on that sale can yield numerous other benefits in other ways. In some cases, just making people happier is the best effect any business can have. It means they'll want to come back to you. The lockers help decrease wait times which makes people happier than they would be without the no loose articles policy. Happier guests is good for business, as well as the guests.



                          How exactly is requiring loose articles be secured, either in a $1 locker, or some other means "exploiting" people who want to take pictures? If SF held a gun to each guest's head and forced their stuff into a paid locker, you may have a point, but guests are free to put their cameras in a zippered pocket, or with a non-riding member of their party, or a $1 temp use locker, or an all-day locker, or their car, or some other means.

                          Honestly, the whole point of the $1 locker is to ensure that NO loose articles are brought to the loading area delaying the load/unload time of each train, thereby decreasing queue wait times. It's a very effective policy, and you also won't loose that antique camera forever should it fall away from you during your ride.



                          Again, this is really basic business. Installing/operating/maintaining those lockers takes money. That money doesn't just appear out of nowhere. Universal overcharges its guests in numerous other ways, and is a completely different financial animal than a SF park is. Trying to compare a theme park to a movie studio/theme park/entertainment district is comparing apples to potato salad.



                          And that's totally your choice, and totally cool. In fact, you could even drive your camera off SF property to your residence or hotel if you wanted to thanks to the free in n' out of the guest parking lot that every paid vehicle has.

                          The lockers are a simple matter of convenience, just like pretty much everything else in the park. Want candy in the park? It costs money. Want food in the park? It costs money. Want to have your loose articles unsecured as you walk around? Great, but you'll need to secure them somehow before you board a ride, and there are lockers provided. Believe it or not, they cost money. The lockers help decrease wait times for everyone, which add value to the overall park product, just like having gift shops & restaurants in the park do. This isn't a matter of exploitation. I believe it's called "running a business."
                          Well if you believe that I have no clue in what I'm talking about then go ahead and look at my user name and look that up on the web. You'll find a company that is very big in the haunted house industry. So as far as questioning my knowledge in business go ahead because your assumption doesn't really mean anything.

                          Saying its not a way of exploiting people doesn't make sense to me either. Thats exactly what it is, and again if it wasn't then the lockers would be free. Hands down. And yes Six Flags is not forcing anyone to put their things in a locker. But for those who do they have to pay. And that's a way of exploiting the public if you ask me.

                          I highly doubt that the wait times are drastically changed due to people putting their things in a locker or with a non riding member of their party. What so instead of 45min its going to be 40 min. The whole idea that it cuts a big time in the line is a bunch of bull.

                          Finally can you tell me where Universal charges more in other areas. I would like to know where. And how its different from any other theme park.

                          Comment


                          • #33
                            Re: Absurd Lockers

                            Honestly, I've found the wait times to be MUCH improved at SFMM since the Lockers have been in.

                            Now, I'm not saying it's been ALL due to the lockers (some of it has to do with the employees and lack of down-time I'm sure) but the lockers DO help. The amount of time that it takes to load/launch a train has been GREATLY reduced.

                            Just look at the amount of time it takes to load a train on Silver Bullet at Knott's and then on Batman. It's staggering the difference.

                            Comment


                            • #34
                              Re: Absurd Lockers

                              ^Agreed!
                              And Silver Bullet's slow dispatch times are made even more obvious by the awful talking on the microphone. But you are right, the lockers have made a great difference in reducing cycle/dispatch times!

                              Comment


                              • #35
                                Re: Absurd Lockers

                                Originally posted by PeoplemoverMatt View Post

                                3) The $1 cheeseburger usually sells fries, sodas, and other various accompaniments along with it which easily makes up the small loss per cheeseburger McD's incurs.
                                AGREED!!!! Have you ever seen the syrup boxes that are hooked up to the soda machines along with the carbonation? Those boxes cost around $25-$30 and they each vend hundreds of sodas. That is where the restaurants are making their money even by giving "free" refills.

                                Did I just agree with something Matt said?
                                "And yes, we implore EVERYBODY to follow the park rules. Having off-ride footage is great, but any still photo's or video's taken ON the coasters at SFMM are strictly against the rules. They are there for your (and everybody's) safety." "Six Flags doesn't allow ANY loose articles on their coasters, and they don't allow video taping on their coasters. " BUT, "​ This is not true. Six Flags does not allow ANY On-Ride video or pictures on the rides. The ONLY way is if you get explicit permission from Park Management." ???

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