Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

10/9: Dead or Alive?

Collapse

Get Away Today

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

    Anyways, I'm done with this. It's just sad to me how some folks fail to see what harm can be brought with chastising and labeling folks with different likes and dislikes instead of celebrating that they have a pretty good diverse community of Disney fans with a wide range of personal values, ideals, backgrounds, and tastes that can be drawn from. What makes me even sadder is that some MiceChatters just celebrated unofficial Gay Days at the Resort and even virtually on MiceChat and probably know first hand how truly harmful labels and ridicule can be by those who think that they know what's best for everyone else, just for having a different opinion... yet in this case it's totally acceptable because it's not against them.

    Originally posted by Chernabog View Post
    I know that you probably don't give a mouse's arse, but your post has been reported to the mods. I'm sure you'll be better appreciated at MouseInfo where you can spread all the venom you want, so do us all a favor, thanks!
    ... and that just proves my point on driving those with differing opinions away... funny thing in all of this DoM business is that it's first victim isn't a DoM at all (lord knows throughout my years working there I've done my share of complaining about decisions made and I'm certainly not a Disney apologist, you can speak to any Disney manager I've worked with... I hold them accountable for their actions and some folks don't like that). But yah, I do care actually... I like MiceChat because of the variety of people here and heck, we're all Disney fans... right?

    But I'll accept my fate if I am banned from the boards for having a different opinion then you and Al. I'm not personal friends with the moderators like I believe you are (correct me if I'm wrong), so it wouldn't shock me if they do what you want... though I would sincerely hope that they would be impartial.
    Last edited by Burnt Toast; 10-09-2007, 04:02 PM.
    Burnt Toast
    The Magic Begins With Me...! 8:P

    Comment


    • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

      Originally posted by Diznyfan View Post
      Are you kidding me! Save the Sign. Its just a sign who cares it sounds like the replacement is going to be 1000% better.
      The sign is already reserved by John Stamos.:blink:

      Comment


      • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

        Originally posted by Burnt Toast View Post
        Anyways, I'm done with this. It's just sad to me how some folks fail to see what harm can be brought with chastising and labeling folks with different likes and dislikes instead of celebrating that they have a pretty good diverse community of Disney fans with a wide range of personal values, ideals, backgrounds, and tastes. What makes me even sadder is that some of you guys just celebrated unofficial Gay Days at the Resort and even virtually on MiceChat and probably know first hand how truly harmful labels and ridicule can be by those who think that they know what's best for everyone else... yet in this case it's totally acceptable because it's not against them.
        I think Al may have opened up a can of this with the DoM bit:
        Last edited by Barbossa; 10-09-2007, 03:50 PM.

        Comment


        • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

          Originally posted by Chernabog View Post
          Now can we please get back to discussing the rest of the article, thanks! Much more interesting.
          The rest of the article sucked!!!!

          So, anything else to discuss?

          Comment


          • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

            For those MC folk who have taken offense to Al's comments regarding the DoMs on the Disney discussion boards, please re-read this section of his article from today:
            "It's well known the Disney company keeps an close eye online, and more than a few times the immediate and unsparingly honest feedback for their latest offerings has resulted in refinements, reworkings and even the rare shutdown of a show or ride. But the gushing DoM fan postings supporting a product that is of a lower quality than what Disney should offer get monitored too - and more than a few times they have been used to try to convince the higher-ups that customers don't care or notice.


            The people who care about quality at Disney are very encouraged by the sea change in management at the company, from Iger on down. Unlike the latter of the two decades under Eisner, or the 10 years with Pressler there is a lot being done right nowadays. But there are still those DoM postings that get printed out by those more concerned about budgets or cutbacks that worry some of the folks spearheading the renaissance going on right now. Walt Disney World in particular suffers from the incredible amount of damage these DoMs can inflict - those little salvos praising the poorest quality shows or attractions can hold back those who want to improve the offerings out there."

            Notice how Al singled out WDW as being the recipient of the most egregious DoM posts? How very interesting and disturbing, given that the former Senior Creative Executive for Creative Development at WDI -- only second in command behind Marty Sklar when he was Principle Creative Executive before becoming the Imagineering Ambassador almost two years ago -- is now only in charge of Imagineering's creative direction for WDW parks sans DAK. Instead of controlling all of Creative Development for WDI, Tom Fitzgerald is simply in charge of Imagineering's direction for MK, EPCOT, and D/MGM aka DHS.

            Gee... I wonder if there could possibly be any kind of connection between the two, no matter how tenuous?


            Fact: several managers and execs in Glendale and Burbank are not happy with John Lasseter's direct connection to Bob Iger. John does not have to "go through channels" in order to run ideas past Bob. And several individuals within the company who used to call the shots and control all projects and/or purse strings are none too pleased with John's role of being the Principle Creative Advisor for WDI since the Pixar acquisition.

            Fact: the disgruntled managers and execs who are not happy with John's role as Principle Creative Advisor, have friends and associates both inside and outside WDC, who witness this unhappiness and choose to do something 'proactive' in an attempt to rectify their friends' or associates' displeasure and loss of control. And part of those proactive attempts involve posting and blogging on the Disney fan sites in an effort to discredit those individuals who believe that the ideology embodied by John Lasseter and Tony Baxter and Bob Weis and other creatives at Disney who now hold the parks' future direction in their professional hands is the correct course of action.

            These DoMs have been unrelenting in their deliberate online campaign to discredit the efforts by Lasseter and certain Imagineering creative leaders to return to the design fundamentals and quality show standards which Walt himself established with Disneyland over five decades ago. Al's comments were mostly directed at those anonymous posters who lack the genuine conviction to engage in honest and legitimate debate regarding the merits and failings of the Disney parks, but instead choose to participate on the boards and blogs as a means to further their friends' and associates' campaigns within Glendale and Burbank to keep their overpromoted and underqualified arses in their overcompensated executive positions and to regain their lost power and control.


            Change is never easy; worthwhile change is always a challenge. I applaud John Lasseter's dedication to reshape WDI to be more like its historical predecessor, WED Imagineering, and less of a political viper pit which developed during the Eisner/Pressler years. And many individuals still employed by WDC, who rose to power during the Eisner/Pressler era, do not wish to go quietly into that dark night, and are doing everything they can to regain their lost power and control.

            The ever-increasing numbers of DoM posters across all Disney fan sites, and not just MC, is proof of their tenacity and determination to do precisely that.
            "Dope smoking insects and reckless driving always work." -- Cousin Orville

            Comment


            • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

              Originally posted by sediment View Post
              The rest of the article sucked!!!!

              So, anything else to discuss?
              ROFLMAO
              I am grateful... grapefruit! ~ Bjork (upon winning Best International Female Artist at the BRIT Awards)
              sigpic



              Founding Member of the BA!

              Comment


              • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                Originally posted by Chernabog View Post
                ROFLMAO
                The thread needed some levity. Happy to oblige. It's a gift......and a curse.


                Anyway, it's good to know that regular MC'ers are not the target of Al's anti-DoM campaign, but it is the outside agitators that are friends/subordinates/sig-others of people who are (or who once were) in charge of the parks.

                Comment


                • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                  Originally posted by BlueSkyDriveBy View Post
                  And part of those proactive attempts involve posting and blogging on the Disney fan sites in an effort to discredit those individuals who believe that the ideology embodied by John Lasseter and Tony Baxter and Bob Weis and other creatives at Disney who now hold the parks' future direction in their professional hands is the correct course of action.

                  These DoMs have been unrelenting in their deliberate online campaign to discredit the efforts by Lasseter and certain Imagineering creative leaders to return to the design fundamentals and quality show standards which Walt himself established with Disneyland over five decades ago. Al's comments were mostly directed at those anonymous posters who lack the genuine conviction to engage in honest and legitimate debate regarding the merits and failings of the Disney parks, but instead choose to participate on the boards and blogs as a means to further their friends' and associates' campaigns within Glendale and Burbank to keep their overpromoted and underqualified arses in their overcompensated executive positions and to regain their lost power and control.
                  Bleh.. there are probably dozens more sock puppet accounts on this site and others where people are pumping ideals and perspectives way more then there are such accounts pumping 'disney is just fine...'

                  The patterns are all too easy to spot - first time posters that jump right in, know all the 'locals' POVs... and manage to post 20+ posts in a single thread and virtually disappear afterwards. The DLR forum is full of 'em.

                  The fact remains.. short of a warrant for committing crimes, its virtually impossible to pinpoint someone using duplicate accounts or hiding identities if the person has any clue. And that doesn't even require going through multiple hops to get to the site, etc.. which when they do, makes it even harder or close to impossible to link people together.

                  As long as sites allow yahoo,gmail,aol etc type addresses.. and can't ban ISPs that proxy all connections.. its impossible to catch the smart person. Good news is.. most aren't smart when they try this BS and are easily caught if someone is inclined to catch them.
                  Check out my blog - Coreplex: Rambling from inside the Grid


                  Am I evil? yes, I am
                  Am I evil? I am man, yes, I am

                  Originally posted by sleepyjeff
                  Disneyland was meant to be sipped not chug-a-lugged

                  Comment


                  • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                    Originally posted by Swisskapolka View Post
                    Great update -- looking forward to all the DCA changes!

                    Can someone explain the best way to convince the powers that be to raise wages and standards in order to make competent cast members show up and stick around? Last summer I had a long talk with a new hire, but as he was over 60, he was basically working at Disneyland for fun and almost seemed to feel his role was to model good work ethics for younger new hires. While that's a great attitude, wouldn't it be great if all new hires shared it?
                    I think Disney should have great pay and benefits, and offer a pension and retirement as a way of keeping good people. It would start possible new hires (and others) thinking about Disney as a place to build a carrer, rather than just a part time Mcjob. Considering the high level of function that is required to be a CM, the expectation put upon CM's by the public, also considering the fact that a "magical day" (helped along by savy CM's) is in the of the marketing mix, part of the sale and the added value of the Disney experience. I behoves Disney to invest in their people.
                    Hello everyone!

                    Comment


                    • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                      Originally posted by Burnt Toast View Post
                      If Al wanted to inflate his ego some more with shock value... he certainly succeeded. Too bad it'll come to the expense of the Disney fan community.
                      The Disney Fan community has had almost no impact on the decisions made at Disney - and now it seems like the community is self destructing.

                      The truth is that the fan community and the internet posters have no relevance on any decisions being made at Disneyland - the only thing that matters are the millions of people who actually pay money to visit the parks.

                      Comment


                      • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                        I like the idea of a save the California sign...sign....me...up....
                        Hello everyone!

                        Comment


                        • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                          Originally posted by jimmay View Post
                          I, for one, find this new branding "DoM" a little problematic. .

                          Labels, profanity, slander, consipiracy theories - these are all arrows in the quiver of the mentally lazy.

                          A good debate is one of well stated opinions and facts, not childish name calling.

                          Comment


                          • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                            Wow, so Al makes up a derisive new word, and posters here immediately start using it as if it's an actual word? I think that's a situation known as a 'cult of personality'.

                            Anyway...

                            Good riddance to Maliboomer and to the Ratatoulille concept.

                            I welcome a new Little Mermaid ride in theory... but what 'land' is it going to be in? Grizzly Peak? San Francisco? Paradise Pier?

                            Is exiting the Little Mermaid through the Palace of Fine Arts still operative? How does that make any sense?

                            Comment


                            • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                              Just to clarify:

                              I have absolutely no problem with someone who enjoys the park as is. I do have a problem with those who see no reason to make it even better simply because they enjoy it as-is. Disney is all about being the ABSOLUTE best. Mediocre is not an option for Disney. Never was and never should be. It goes against everything that the name stands for.

                              DoM is not a label on people, but on a state-of-mind that is dangerous to Disney as a company. Not just the parks division.

                              Our revels now are ended. These our actors, As I foretold you, were all spirits and Are melted into air, into thin air: And, like the baseless fabric of this vision, The cloud-capp'd towers, the gorgeous palaces, The solemn temples, the great globe itself, Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve And, like this insubstantial pageant faded, Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff As dreams are made on, and our little life Is rounded with a sleep. mycroft16 on Twitter

                              Comment


                              • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                                basically i stopped reading less then half way through pg 5. I'm willing to bet the rest of the talks are about the DoM's and APers battle its quite stupid. Disney has slacked at times but they r in the works of fixing it aren't they?

                                DCA= TLC
                                Small world = TLC
                                fantasyland dark rides= TLC
                                and so on

                                its just all stereotypes that will eventually destroy the world. yes some people are happy with what Disney has right now, some aren't. its called an opinion we are all entitled to it. all Al was trying to do was say hey Disney uses this to not take care of the parks as much he just wants us to also throw some constructive criticism/opinions into the mix of our praise.

                                Comment


                                • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                                  Metallic gauze ruffles oil loss...
                                  Oh sorry.
                                  I read the article, and what everyone says- and really, what is wrong with liking stuff we think is horrible? Eye of the beholder people...eye of the beholder..

                                  Comment


                                  • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                                    Some eyes require prescription lenses.

                                    Comment


                                    • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                                      Ok now I see at least three for saving the sign. Maybe one of you computer Savy bloggers could signature campaign to help save the sign. It would just be a big shame to remove the CALIFORNIA sign. Sometimes these petetions work out the TV show Jerico was saved from being canceled by an online petition. Keeping the sign would not be a hugh expense, so I think if there is enough support Disney would keep it. I really don't see what Al has against it. THe sign adds character.
                                      Dave

                                      Comment


                                      • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                                        Originally posted by MrLiver View Post
                                        ...the only thing that matters are the millions of people who actually pay money to visit the parks.
                                        Too bad there are millions of guest-counts that don't pay enough to visit the parks. And there are millions of other people who DON'T go because the one-day price is way too high.
                                        Fix this, and there would be enough money to pay the high-quality CMs (and lure better candidates from other employers), pay for newer and more plussed attractions, a desperation in TDA when the counts fall to do something about it. (Currently, there is little panic, because of the lower-cost-admission-per-visit option available.)

                                        Comment


                                        • Re: 10/9: Dead or Alive?

                                          Originally posted by bigwavedave View Post
                                          Ok now I see at least three for saving the sign. Maybe one of you computer Savy bloggers could signature campaign to help save the sign. It would just be a big shame to remove the CALIFORNIA sign. Sometimes these petetions work out the TV show Jerico was saved from being canceled by an online petition. Keeping the sign would not be a hugh expense, so I think if there is enough support Disney would keep it. I really don't see what Al has against it. THe sign adds character.
                                          the entry gates are being moved out to the point where the sign is it would take the cost to move it out and that could create trouble for disney mornings and croweded times when lines have been known to meet from disneyland and adventure

                                          Comment

                                          Get Away Today Footer

                                          Collapse
                                          Working...
                                          X